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Russian Girls and Older Men – Part 1

08/04/2006
By

This is a VERY popular topic that I often get asked to respond to so here goes..

Yes..

Can I go home now?

Oh wait I am home.. Alright so while you’re here go ahead and pull up a chair, I’ll pour the coffee and we can just keep on talking.

Let’s start with something obvious that we men need to be reminded about.. And by the way it’s something most American women are in DEEP Denial with.

It’s called women getting old.

You see the feminist have sold this line to American women that..”YES, you can have it all!” You can put off motherhood, have the killer career, have enriching and liberated relationships like they do in Sex in the City (ie be a Slut) and STILL have a child and then ONLY WHEN YOU ARE REALLY READY to settle down (aka late 30′s and above).. then you can try to find your “life partner”.

Wow.. Doesn’t THIS sound completely wonderful and normal to you?

Wait it’s get’s better.. And here’s the part I love.. The part the feminist not only left out.. but BURIED..

And they have a good reason for trying to desperately spin this because here’s the TRUTH.

A woman’s currency as a potential wife quickly drops in the eyes of a Man starting with her early 30′s and UP.

Her AGE goes UP… Her VALUE goes DOWWWN.

It’s like a gradually sloping downward curve on a chart that displays value vs. time. But if this chart were a ski slope it would be a short gentle slide that drops off the edge of a cliff..

Oh sure maybe she can be a great business partner, colleague or “friend”. Hell maybe she can even be a cool sex partner too.. BUT a key part of her value as a woman starts swirling down the drain and their ain’t nothing she can do about it no matter how much she love’s the way Cher looks or delude herself into thinking that she can be like Demi Moore and “have” a MUCH younger man too! Why just think about how “successful” a late 40′s Sharon Stone was in her latest movie.. playing guess what.. just another older narcissistic psycho.. This movie was clearly a “hit” because obviously all of us really needed to be reminded of this in our lives.. We needed to be reminded once more that the older an American woman get’s the more likely it is for her to turn into a competitor.

The really funny thing is that just when a “Progressive” woman is ready to seriously look for a husband IS RIGHT AT THE TIME her value as a potential wife starts to landslide.

So no matter what a man may “say” to a woman in this age group (usually in order to get her into the sack) ..

“I Love you baby.. I want to be with you forever.. blah blah blah..

There’s a strong voice in the back of his head that says.. “Cool.. I can get some action and I don’t have to marry her!.. What a deal!”

It won’t matter how the feminist try to spin this as a GOOD thing for women. And by the way.. the latest term defining older women having sex with younger men is something I hear called “Cougars”.. the new title doesn’t matter.. Because guys there’s just nothing sader then watching a dignified woman turning herself into a jaded old whore.

Maybe women aren’t good at understanding the value of time. Men generally don’t have a problem with this.. all guys know that they want to be winning the game WAY before the 2 minute warning sounds. Because of this we also instinctively know that we want to start the game with a younger and stronger teammate as opposed to someone who already has a retired jersey number.

Now saying that I do want to mention the key difference between a an older woman who is like a “cougar” and a another woman who has been in a lasting marriage for a long time..

It’s hard as hell for a guy to dump his buddy. Especially if they’ve been playing together since they were both kids in little league. It’s not natural for guys to do this because his “buddy”.. his long term wife.. understands him and can anticipate his every move which in this case is a very good thing since both of them are always trying to rack up the score while being on the SAME team! Also it’s no fun for a guy to finally win a championship and then try to reminisce about it alone. This is because the older a guy gets the more his history becomes important to him and the more he needs to share it with someone who will accept and love him. In a case like this.. this woman.. his wife has a value that increases with time and not the other way around. Get it?

So how does this all relate to Russian Women?

Simple.. Russian girls at a very early age understand the law of nature which determines a woman’s value as a potential mate and mother based on age. It’s because they are constantly reminded of it every year from the time the flowers first starts appearing in spring.. until the harsh autumn winds blow them away.. which ultimately leads to a frigid Russian winter turning everything into ice. Russian girls have the most vivid reminder possible that mother nature only allows for very little time for life to replenish itself. So these girls instinctively know that when the time comes… don’t waste it.

You might be saying.. “this is all fine and enlightening but why can’t they just go with a man closer to her own age then with and older guy.”

Well there are some good reasons for this.

ONE

In general the younger a Russian man is the less he wants to get married. And even when he does get married while he’s still young then the odds are very much against this union lasting due to an existing field of plenty around him.

TWO

The vast majority of younger Russian men are not stable enough financially to provide even the most basic needs that a wife and kids require. To give you an idea of the economies of scale here. The average Russian salary ranges is between $150 to $300 per month. If it’s difficult for a young man to even satisfy this lower range then this is a BIG sign to the girls that it would be a very bad decision to marry him especially when he is still trying to get started in life. This combined with #1 above only doubles the problem.

THREE

We all know that older guys tend to have more money but what’s also interesting is that once they’ve selected a girl he is far less likely to stray and leave her. An older man is more likely to be in it for the long haul and better able to support a family both emotionally and financially as well.

FOUR

Many Russian girls grow up without fathers due to the high rate of separation that is often initiated by the Men in this society. All girls crave a strong stable man they can look up to and depend upon, but these girls in particular are even more geared to need an older man’s emotional connection.

FIVE

Demographics and a developing economy simply do not favor the women here so there is a huge populations of girls who have not received any significant attention from members of the opposite sex because they aren’t considered as attractive as the large numbers of super models that walk around here. If they receive genuine interests it’s not something they treat lightly. Keep in mind that most of these girls would in no ways be considered ugly by American or Western standards. Women like Jennifer Aniston, Julia Roberts or Jennifer Lopez would EASILY fall into this category when you compare their looks to the overall population of Russian Girls.

These women may receive some attention but usually it will be from men who are just looking for sex or from men who are not even qualified to decently associate with them on a social level.

So all of these reasons add up pretty quick and as you can see very profound things happen to a society when you start dealing with shifting demographic balances between men and women.

AGE Differences

So the next thing you are probably wondering about is what level of age differences can exist? Well as you can guess this depends on a few factors. Typically the younger the girl, the smaller the age difference is between her and her mate.. The older a woman, the wider the possible age gap. Although I have seen many exceptions, in general a woman in her 20′s will happily accept a man who is between 10 to 15 years older then her without blinking an eye.

Did I just hear a collective “Right ON!” being yelled by you guys?

Well if you like hearing that then you’ll LOVE to know that a 10 to 15 year age difference is just a BASIC base to start with! Starting from there the difference can be much greater and I see it all the time here.

Now it’s not generally normal for a 50 plus year old guy to go with an 18 year old girl but again over here I have seen plenty of exceptions depending on the personal backgrounds of each and the physical, mental and emotional “levels of acceptance” that exist. (put your thinking caps on here because notice I didn’t say “levels of compatibility”.. I’ll let you think about it for a while..) For example my closest friend here was 47 when he first met his finance who was 19 at the time and they have a great relationship.

How young of a girl can you go with? It really depends on both of you. Many Russian guy who are only in their late 30′s to 40′s looks like hell compared to a more health conscious population of American men his same age. Consuming hard liquor or copious amounts of beer and cigarettes seems to be a national past time here while thank God that is clearly not the case in the US. This lack of a healthy lifestyle is literally killing off the male Russian population 15 to 20 years before his Western counterpart on average. So it is very common to see most American guys looking and acting much younger then Russian men who are their same age.

The better shape you are in and the more open you are to new experiences the more likely it is for you to gain a relationship with a significantly younger girl if that is what you desire.

Now keep in mind that I don’t want you to even think about exluding “older” Russian women here from your selection process because there are some key advantages with them as well that I will get into later.. You will be surprised to hear that by our local standards an “older Russian Women” is someone in her early 30′s and above. One of the things I like about these women is that they tend to be super traditional and this has it’s own special appeal because they’ve had no exposure growing up to things like MTV. I’ve known significant numbers of EXTREMELY HOT Russian women in their 30′s being with guys who are in their 50′s, 60′s, and even 70′s. This type of age arrangement is more common then you would think throughout Russia.

Are you getting all of this down? Good.. Cause I’m going to stop here for now and let you finish your coffee and absorb all of this.

The next time we meet I’ll talk with you about the advantages and disadvantages of being with either a younger Russian girl or an “older” Russian woman.

Isn’t it funny how certain types of information can just make your day? ;)

Stay Tuned!

(Russian Girls and Older Men – Part 2)

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165 Responses to Russian Girls and Older Men – Part 1

  1. Dave Smith on 08/04/2006 at 2:17 pm

    so i should not feel like i’m robbing the cradle becouse all the women that have been e-mailing me are in the 25 to 30 range. { i’m 41}although there is this one lady wh is 39 and she has flowing black hair and green eyes that would stop a bullet train. Dave

  2. rw_man on 08/04/2006 at 6:19 pm

    You can totally relax and confidently leave any fears of “robbing the cradle” behind you if you are dealing with Russian girls in that age range.

    It really comes down to how well you get along with the girl. Younger girls and “Older Women” (yeah like they’re really older by American standards..) have different types of appeal for different guys. As I’ve said before.. Always focus on what you want with a woman in your life and there is a good chance you will find that here.

    Cheers..

  3. Rule62 on 08/04/2006 at 8:07 pm

    I am 43 and engaged to a 26 year old from Vladivostok. My experience is that not only is this difference acceptable, it is preferable in their eyes for all the reasons that were just discussed. It is not a “problem” – it is the preferred norm.

  4. rw_man on 08/04/2006 at 8:23 pm

    It sure is.. And by the way much congratulations on you engagement! I would love to see many more men like you also reporting this fantastic news to me as well!

    And Maybe you can help! :)

    I have set up a bunch of ways to make this information more popular and more prominently listed on the internet. All you or any other guy has to do is just click the links!

    You can click the links on the bottom of each article to specifically promote it to key blog listing services like Digg, delicious, and MyYahoo..

    Or you can click on the links to the bar on the right hand side sarting with Technorati down to Spurl.

    Now you might have to take a few seconds out on each link to fill in a new account if you don’t already have one but hey it’s all for a good cause!

    And I gotta tell you.. it’s such an enriching and satisfying experience to receive comments like yours with men who are finally begining to see the big picture.

    Your insights and share’s just maybe the key piece of info that unlocks the door for another man. So please continue to contribute!

    Cheers!
    GL

  5. Bart on 08/09/2006 at 6:01 pm

    Hello,
    I’m a 34 yrs old guy from Belgium seeking a new relationship with a woman 10-15 yrs younger than me. I’ve got 2 relationships with Belgian girls (first 22 yrs, second 24 yrs) and they broke up because I worked for them, they didn’t even think about getting a job themselves too. I like a girl who works also. I don’t need a “housewife”. I need a partner and hope to find it in Russia or a country in the neighborhood. Now I’m seeking a contactperson over there.

    Greetz.

    Bart

  6. Natalia on 08/09/2006 at 7:49 pm

    To All Men who “Date” Younger Women from Eastern Europe,
    These girls are probably slaves kidnapped for the sex alve trade. Do you really think these beautiful, young women actually want to be with ugly old American farts like you?????? Get a reality check. Most young women are attracted to men their own age, and most SECURE, INTELLIGENT and DECENT men ar attracted to WOMEN THEIR OWN AGE. You all obviously need to grow up and start respecting women for their intelligence and innate goodness, not just for their physical beauty, which according to you, , only the young possess.

    Natasha – A young woman whi is attracted to men her own age, who is tired of being leered at by older men.

    • MARK on 06/03/2011 at 8:36 pm

      Natalia, I doubt that you are who you say you are. Is it okay with you if men your age “leer at you”? Why would you not expect older, wiser men to do it even more frequently? And who are you to decide whether a young woman should value emotional and financial stability along with wisdom and life experience less than a young, good looking and frequently alcoholic or drug using young man who has no other objective than a sexual conquest, as many as possible. Each is entitled to make his or her own decision. And as far as deception, there are good and bad people in every country in the world. Although many of these spectacularly beautiful Russian girls/women are probably come-ons for the dating agencies, some are real. The problem is figuring out which ones.
      I want a partner/wife/best friend beside me. I have been alone for six years and would cherish a beautiful, kind, intelligent, affectionate and romantic young woman who wants this attention. I know I have a great deal to offer and I am older. But I am sincere, warm, smart, wise and far from poor.

      Mark

  7. rw_man on 08/09/2006 at 11:39 pm

    Hi Natalia..

    Gotta give you credit for taking your best shot here and I actually welcome your comment and in our home your anger actually provides a crucial function. Let’s see if your bright enough to figure out why..

    I have an offer to make you since I can see that you are so passionate with your arguement. I would like to challenge you to actually verify if your claims are correct.

    I invite you to travel to East Europe, Russia or any FSU country to see if we are only dealing with sex trade slaves who obviously cannot think for themselves because you seem to insist by your tone that you are the only enlightened one here among all of us..

    In the process of doing this you can also check to see if my claims on younger Russian women wanting to be with significantly older guys is true or false.

    If you don’t like their choices well I invite you to try to show them the light as you see it and to see how far you will get.

    If you are not willing to do that then do yourself a big favor and don’t waste your time and embarass yourself any further showing off your complete ignorance and insecurities.

    Believe me I’m suggesting this to you for your benefit and not for mine. While we are on this topic I want to ask you an honest question.. how do you feel about gay people getting together? Are you for it against it? Do you support it or do you think these people shouldn’t make up their minds for themselves. I’d really like to know.

    Your answer will tell me if you are a double standards hypocrite or a total control freak..

    One word of unsolicited but truly wise advice.

    Focus on the things you can control vs. the things you can’t. Because quite frankly you will never be able to control us or alter our path. And if you continue to try this will bring you much unhappiness.. and very little if none of that will actually come from us.

    Your abilty to understand this will completely determine your level of happiness in your life… because right now you are obviously not just angry with me or my group. I bet you you are angry at many things.. like older guys staring at you which clearly has nothing to do with us now does it?

    You are always welcome back.. but do some real homework first or go and find the answers for yourself instead of from MTV,Oxygen or the Women’s channel.

    GL

  8. rw_man on 08/09/2006 at 11:40 pm

    Bart you can email me at galacticlove at gmail.com.. and don’t worry about natasha here..

  9. megan on 08/16/2006 at 7:07 am

    im a 20 yr old Australian woman, engaged to a 42 Yr old Canadian man, and we work out wonderfully. He is stable minded and very doting and affectionate. We met while travelling together and fell in love. I thought he was 29 when we met. in fact he was 40. Living in the western world with big age gaps can be difficult when it comes to revealing each persons age, but otherwise it is possible for couples like us to be very happy and lasting.

  10. rw_man on 08/16/2006 at 9:38 am

    Hi Megan!

    Thank you for joining us :)

    Your age difference with your finance’ is considered quite normal here. I’m sure your finance’ loves you for the feelings and good qualities that you naturally bring out in him. In many cases that requires a young woman like yourself who is willing to be well.. a “real woman”. Someone who is sensitive and who can trust him as a man.

    I’m sure he’s a very lucky man for having you. It’s obvious that you both have very clear and complimentary roles in each other’s lives and this indeed will make a solid relationship if you both nurture this.

    I’m happy for you guys! Please tell your friends about my site and keep posting!

    Cheers,
    GL

  11. Steven on 08/17/2006 at 1:59 pm

    Oh I have GOT to answer Natalia.

    Natalia said:
    “To All Men who “Date” Younger Women from Eastern Europe, These girls are probably slaves kidnapped for the sex alve trade.”

    Oh, and you got this information …. WHERE exactly? A womyn’s studies seminar? Oprah? Or your own biased and sexist mind that cannot fathom WHY men would not want to be with the wonderfulness that is you? (Cue angels singing here)

    Natalia said:
    “Do you really think these beautiful, young women actually want to be with ugly old American farts like you?????? Get a reality check.”

    Feeling a bit insecure are we? Maybe that soft and loving attitude you project is the reason you are “alone by choice”, bitter, and jealous.

    Here’s a tip – try to be NICE, loving, giving and not so snotty. But, hey, that anger you have must keep you warm at night when you are in your bed “alone by choice.”

    Natalia said:
    “Most young women are attracted to men their own age, and most SECURE, INTELLIGENT and DECENT men ar attracted to WOMEN THEIR OWN AGE.”

    Ahhhh troting out the shaming language. Old trick, doesn’t much work, but I guess you had to give it the H.S. bitch try.

    Oh, and why is it high school, college, and most women I know date men OLDER men? Is it that nasty ol’ “Patriarchy”.

    I suppose you find men who date younger women “dirty old men”, but women who are “cougars” who date younger men are “empowered”. Careful, your feminism is showing.

    Natalia:
    “You all obviously need to grow up and start respecting women for their intelligence and innate goodness,”

    Wow that loving “innate goodness” is sooooo attractive when it’s spit in our faces with vile invective.

    Here’s a tip, we will date who we WANT to date. Maybe if you were sweet as you think you are (read: self delusion) then maybe you would be ATTRACTIVE to men. Just a guess on that one ..

    Natalia said:
    “not just for their physical beauty, which according to you, , only the young possess.”

    Hmmm, yea it sure is WEIRD when men like to be in the company by some tight bodied, giving, loving, bubbly and sincere woman. We must have some fetish that feminist have created.

    But, then again, WOMEN who date younger men are NOT to be sneered at, ridiculed, or harshly talked about.

    Damn that equality minded thought process I have.

    Natalia (or is it Natasha)said:
    “Natasha – A young woman whi is attracted to men her own age, who is tired of being leered at by older men.”

    Ahhhh, subjective female thinking at it’s best. It’s harrasment if the guy leers, but ONLY if the woman is offended and does not like the guy. If she DOES like it, it’s a welcome and wanted show of admiration.

    I have a solution for you thought Natalia/Natasha – just expose those men to your personality and they will flee like scalded kittens.

    Bitter, “alone by choice”, and clueless as to why she can’t get a date. Truly a product of American feminism.

    I’ve got more quarters, wanna play again?

    Steven

  12. Ekaterina on 08/17/2006 at 3:34 pm

    I’ve just come across this article and unfortunately have to admit that all that was said in it is true. I am 22 y.o., russian, and can tell that a major part of 22-26 y/o guys are not able to have a family; first because of financial instability (though for me it’s not the biggest problem) but second because they are mentally not ready to be responsible for their deeds at all(and that’s a real PROBLEM!). Which is sad.I used to date with a guy of my own age and he turned out to be a perfect asshole who doesn’t know what he wants at all (though, by the way, he was american not russian).Now if i have a relationship it’ll be a guy at least 10 years older. Most of my friends have the same opinion.So I can understand women who date or who are married older men.The only fact the author of the article didnt mention is that russian men have a lot of prejudices (“if she is beautiful, she must be stupid!”, “if she is educated and intelligent, she must be a bitch”, or “she cannot be attractive and smart at the same time!”)as a result they date with attractive and smart women and tend to marry very plain and dump ones because of their stupid fears.
    I’d also like to say a special HELLO to Bart and tell him that i also share his opinion.
    Cheers :)

  13. rw_man on 08/17/2006 at 8:14 pm

    Hello Ekaterina!

    Nice to see you jumping in with us! We need more REAL RUSSIAN WOMEN like yourself to join us so please tell your girlfriends as well :)

    Thank you for the validation on my accuracy! We try to do our best and it’s always nice to get some confirmation from a Russian lady like yourself.

    I know I forgot to mention the prejudices that the men here have so thanks for bringing that up..

    BUT

    One thing you forgot to mention ;) about many Russian guys getting married here is that they may pick a stable normal looking girl to get married to but many of them will go out and get other girlfriends and mistresses that look like models.

    It’s one of those other facts of life here that is so radically different from what we are used to in the US for example.

    Keep posting and get your girlfriends in here too!
    Cheers
    GL

  14. Ronin_RWP on 08/31/2006 at 9:17 am

    Hello,

    My Russian Wife and I share a generation gap. I believe it to be an asset in an AM/RW relationship in that I can bring to the table skills on how to maintain long lasting relationships. Such skills go wanting by RW since it is difficult for them to have long standing relations.

    Another point is that Russian Women may prefer older men for the fact that they are survivors of a brutal proving ground… natural selection and the like if you will. As such many RW believe and/or make the association that older men have markedly enhanced genes that are worth carrying on into the next generation. Us older Western Men are fortunate to be the recipients of this thought.

    Ronin_RWP

  15. Taras on 08/31/2006 at 4:58 pm

    Natalia, to which men you’re attracted to is your own business, but there are very good reasons why men prefer women younger than themselves. One is, young people have a tough time starting out financially and any man with a brain will not start a family until he can bear the responsibilities that go with it. Another is that younger women are the only ones who can have children. To expect men who are 40 and older like myself to marry women near our own age and have kids is lunacy. Older men are more mature and are better equipped to avoid the many traps that are out there. In case you haven’t noticed, marriage is where both parties depend on each other for certain things. Now I know what you mean about men leering at you, I see the hispanic illegals where I live do that all the time at any woman that passes by. But I’d sooner look at women who are in their 20′s or early 30′s before looking at one my age if I were looking for a spouse. Sorry Natalia, but biology has trounced you there, it’s not going to change unless the only way babies will be born is out of a lab. Which will likely be most American women’s destiny because they’ve alienated and pissed off American men. Best thing you can do if the sentiment is not mutual is a polite but firm, “Not interested.” A real man would not take it personally and move on.

    Taras

  16. John Smith on 09/20/2006 at 2:07 am

    Well I’m homosexual, (male) 21, and can’t stand dating people my own age… I’m from England, but I can relate to people from Russia, etc, because there is a 13 year age gap between my partner and I, who’s my fiance of 6 years…

    Yes, I was with him from 15! I’ve learned my lessons far too early.

    I’ve just been burnt so much with going out with fickle people of very small mind and experience, that I can’t really say that I’m attracted to a puppy, when I prefer to have a real man that knows the way of the world by my side! I do feel a bit sad sometimes that we speak another language, but I’ve grown to be more mature over the years, and I am a different person to who I was when I met him. I’m certainly an asset to him, and not a liability anymore.

    There is a sense of women, and even me – feeling that the only reliable men that there are, or at least the ones that are going to last the long term, are much older than me. And it’s depressing. The older I get, even at 21 in gay-years, makes me less and less attractive to men. I didn’t make this choice out of instinct. At school I wanted someone my own age, and never dreamed that I’d grow the way that I am now, but perhaps I’m just more pragmatic now.

    “Old farts” indeed Natasha – I do like to hear difference of opinion, and sadly, you’re probably true in some cases. I’ve heard so much of human trafficking, and it’s heart breaking what happens to Russian women. Some are unable to escape, and are lead to the west thinking someone is there to love them, and they’re put into organised crime syndicates, as if merely objects, and sometimes, their families are watched so they’re warned, “if you leave, they’re going to be killed”

    I think you sound like a Russian friend I’d probably have! I have a lot of Polish friends. I can see all points of view. I don’t think that you’re all neccesarily fair to the American Dream, at which you all sneer.

    You forget that your mothers are american women, and “America” is something that is very difficult to put into words. Specifically going for a younger women for biological reasons is all fair, but a womans value, goes up with age, and not down. A man of sense might be able to reason ‘sowing his oats’ young, and living the dream, but I think a true man settles down young with someone his own age, and invests his future in that. Men start out without a dime, and that’s how you’re born into the world.

    That’s how the generation of my grandparents did it, and they had realtionships that lasted a lifetime, and rarely broke up home.

  17. rw_man on 09/20/2006 at 9:26 am

    Wow.. even Gay guys are into this subject now.. :)

    John I appreciate your honest and civil tone and not having any particular “anti-Russian Women as Marriage partners” agenda with you post.

    I don’t agree with everything you are talking about in regards to slaming the American Dream or going with the common perception that many Russian women are locked up in some Mafia run whorehouse.

    You and I both know there are always exceptions to every rule. However I’m willing to put the information out that I do based on a well founded belief that there is a silent majority of Men who are not willing to put up with many of the sexual and political imbalances that exist in our modern society.

    Men who are looking for solid and stable families regardless of age. I’m sure that because you are Gay that you of all people would want others to respect your choice. If you believe you found love then you found it regardless of what the outside world says..

    Basically it’s nobody’s business but your own.

    If two adults find love.. then they find it. And since you are 21 now I can’t really criticize the decisions that you made when you were 15 cause it’s all in the past.

    What I’m advocating in terms of a free exchange and a free market of potential relationships between Western Men and Russian Women is probably far less controversial then your deal. But it deserves complete respect for the sanctity of two people who are able to call their own shots for their own lives regardless.

    Anyways I gotta admit that your post is one of the more unusual ones but it’s still a another opporutnity for me to get my point across.

    Cheers Dude.. GL

  18. Anthony on 09/21/2006 at 3:55 pm

    Hello I am a 40 year old male raised in europe and now living in Canada. I need to know if you bring a women from eastern europe to north america, will she see that her value is increased
    here and eventually dump you. I know very difficult question.

    I recognize the beauty of a russian women, but what also holds my attention is there intellecual mind and strenght. I also find they appreciate a strong male and respect him instead of challenging him on every issue like many of the north american counterpart

  19. rw_man on 09/22/2006 at 6:36 am

    Hi Anthony,

    Much of this will completely depend on the character of the girl to start with. We certainly have bad ones along with good ones. But as I’ve tried to illustrate with this Blog the good ones are easy to find and accessible.

    The first thing I would look into is the type of family she came from and what type of desire she has to create one herself. Is her desire based on material ideas or is it based on family ones. Answer this question regarding the girl of your focus and you will determine her actions in any situation and environment.

    In anycase you really have NOTHING to lose by expanding your realm of choices.. Only everything to potentially gain along with alot more wisdom to gain and to share with other Men.

    Good luck and please spread the word with your fellow brothers..

    Cheers, GL

  20. Greg on 10/26/2006 at 2:06 pm

    I really loved your blog site and would like to visit more often..GL , I’ve enjoyed your answers and believe this to be helpful.Greg

  21. rw_man on 10/26/2006 at 4:08 pm

    Hi Greg,

    Thanks for your comments and welcome aboard! I’m glad you are finding this material helpful. If you’d like to return the favor then please tell your buddies about us!

    Cheers, GL

  22. Canajun on 11/10/2006 at 12:48 pm

    Interesting topic and ideas GL. You wit, wisdom and insite are so refreshing and topical. The reasoning and input from others enlightening. We sometimes think we are the only ones going through thses issues. It’s heartening to know so many of us share these ghastly experiences.
    :)

    Canajun

  23. rw_man on 11/10/2006 at 1:49 pm

    That’s why this blog exists Canajun :) to fill you in on what’s happening out here.

  24. Canajun on 11/10/2006 at 3:27 pm

    Thank you, thank you, thank you……….
    :( :( :(

  25. John on 11/24/2006 at 7:06 pm

    It is pshychologically proven that :
    1. men look for a woman with looks like a bombshell and sizes 90-60-90 (european sizes scale) to be sure she is perfect to reproduce.
    2. woman look at first pace for a man that will be able to shelter the offspring and protect her against others.
    This in fact is all old “news”.
    My doubts inside this subject lie different. I understood (so far) European or American men going to live in the FSU, with their new Russian girlfriend or new Russian wife, do not have to face a cultural shock like a Russiam woman has to undergo compared to the normal or more “ususal” way around. => The Russian woman emigrating her country towards her new boyfriend or future hubby. Because In my humble opinion, once a “model” look a like Russian wife is indulged for some years into this “westernized” culture we live in. Her eyes open and she will look for “better” oportunities in many occasions. (Especially when there is an age gap of +15 years between both partners). I know men that once married super Russian models 15 years younger to themselves. 3 years later, the bird flew out to find herself a much “younger” western man :-), which is more then understandeable. Do not ask me why, but it happens very frequently. So I believe it is more likely common to find and remain married with a Russian woman which is matured completely and closer to your own age range, besides taking a young frivouleous bird, with MTV attitudes. And…my true convincing mind tells me… it wont change for the better. Mc Donald, Channel, Maybeline, Vuiton,Delveaux, Mercedes Benz, Porsche, MTV, The western culture is a hard fact inside the majority of cities of any Russian and FSU republic today ! Changing mentallity and also the younger generations. My deal is :
    1. when you want a “young” russian bride (15 years younger then yourself); move to russia with your job. or face the fact you have a 50 % chance to restart a new relation every 3 – 5 years.
    2. when you wanna play more “safe” with a russian woman. Take someone upto max 10 years of age difference. Especially IF you want her to live with you in the rotten spoiled western world. Usually she will be realistic enough to see through this “scenery of the West”.

  26. Hero on 11/24/2006 at 8:01 pm

    Hi John,

    I and a lot of other men agree with you. Great minds think alike!

  27. Alex on 11/25/2006 at 7:30 am

    Hello,

    Through reading and scanning this blogset, I came across some very interesting posts. Although the aforementioned is just a trivial introductory statement, what I really have to say is more to the point. Don’t overly exert tension towards people who do not share the same views and points as yourself (Although this could so be said to me, the poster, that is not the subject matter for this conversation and will be assumed as ignored). It was apparant for N’s distaste and somewhat vile comprehension of cross-cultural lifestyles, but that is in itself gives insight into the cultural expectations and rearings of women (In such an examined social-economical strucutre). The response(s), as given so hastily by the responders, also feeds into the frezied cycle of belittling of other viewpoints.

    In short, the preprogramming given to all people is very similar to a ‘}{‘ design. To understand and figure out what the specifications and exact reasonings behind the design are your job alone.

    Sincerely,
    The rambling incoherent thoughts of a sleep deprived human being who is now writing a ridiculously extensive trail-on closing to somehow relieve himself of a certain expectation unbeknownst to everyone yet plainly obvious is a grander scheme of things.

    Or: Shut_up_leave@hotmail.com

  28. rw_man on 11/25/2006 at 11:43 am

    Hi John,

    Welcome aboard and thanks for some of the good points there. The locals keep it in the neighborhood of 10 to 15 years as well in terms of age difference.

    Please tell your friends about us.. Cheers, GL

  29. rw_man on 11/25/2006 at 11:45 am

    Hi Alex,

    Either you are a total ingenious madman.. or a crazy genius ;) Go get some sleep and come back with some more “coherent cognitive clauses” :) Oh and please tell your friends too.. GL

  30. Alex on 11/25/2006 at 7:01 pm

    Hello again,

    Curious and amused I felt myself compelled to return to this blog. Somewhere in this service that is being written by people, I feel some sort of demand that requires a truthful touch.

    As for the “coherent cognitive clauses”, I understand to some extent what you are saying, but that is as far as my comprehension goes. To say the very least, the thoughts that pass through here are a bountiful source of knowledge and human resource.

    (Aforementioned is censored due to it being borderline trivial and/or belittling.) You have my gratitude and support (Which is apparently not needed, yet is a measure of good faith in terms of the ‘moderator(s)’ allowance of my posting.)

    Sincerely,
    The guy who gets to go paint the trim of the house in fifteen minutes.

  31. Irina on 11/28/2006 at 2:40 am

    Good luck in your dreamworld, guys :) Russian women DO NOT prefer older men, they just don’t have a choice. That’s it. Very simple. And yes, once they are out of the cage (the FSU) they will look for someone they can fall in love with. Because they are very very romantic. Just ask yourself an honest question: if we were in America, and we were of the same socioeconomic status, would she like me? If the answer is no, then it is no whether she is in Russia or elsewhere. Out of all of my girlfriends that are mail order brides only one is still married(most divorce) and the last time I checked she was very friendly with men other than her husband (oops, forgot to mention that statistics shows that in Russia it is common for both men and women to cheat…) so like i said good luck in your wonderland… like they say if it seems too good to be true, then it is! ciao

  32. rw_man on 11/30/2006 at 5:07 am

    No they do have a choice Irina.. And they always have..
    And I wouldn’t put most of them in the category of desperation that you’ve put yourself into. There are free to choose younger Men at anytime. No one forces them to be with older Men.
    You are implying that somehow these women are either stupid, or miserable in their decision to be with older men. I completely disagree with you. And it’s sure as hell not your place to tell anyone the restrictions as to how or where they can find Love.

  33. Canajun on 11/30/2006 at 1:54 pm

    It sounds as though this Irina may be an American woman with the backbone of a weasel, not wanting to admit the truth. Perhaps I assume incorrectly, but her english and word useage seems rather suspicious.
    :-
    Canajun

  34. Hero on 11/30/2006 at 3:20 pm

    Rw_man, you said:

    “The locals keep it in the neighborhood of 10 to 15 years as well in terms of age difference. ”

    Even so, there must be quite a few couples with an age difference of 20+ years, right?

  35. Eric on 11/30/2006 at 5:30 pm

    Love your blog I have been looking for like this.

    The fact is I’m really tired of American women, so I started looking at russian women and come to realize that if I didn’t have two kids I would pack my bags and leave.

    My real question is do these girls really want to leave family and friends behind to go someplace completely strange to them?

  36. rw_man on 11/30/2006 at 5:40 pm

    Hi Hero,

    Yes there are greater age differences especially the older the man gets. 30 year old woman with a mid fifties man is common for example and so on.

  37. rw_man on 11/30/2006 at 5:43 pm

    Hi Eric,

    Welcome aboard, Yes many of these women want to try to have a better life in the US or the West.

    They’ve heard and seen so much about the US for example from TV and Movies that they have a perception of what life is like which takes away the “strangeness” factor whether it’s accurate or not.

    Good Luck with your pursuit of this..

    GL

  38. Eric on 11/30/2006 at 5:54 pm

    The one thing I have noticed is they all pretty much say the same thing in there profiles.

    Do they look at love and support and caring more important than physical appearance. Because if this is true I don’t see why I should even bother to keep looking for an American women.

    And whats the best way to get in tough with these women any advise would be helpful.

    Another question I have been thinking about is are these girls really looking for marriage or are they looking for a free ride thinking thing are better here?

  39. rw_man on 11/30/2006 at 5:59 pm

    Eric it would be worth it for you to spend some time reading all the material in my blog and then coming back if you have any other specific questions. All of the answers you are looking for are probably in here already so take a few hours out and read though what is here. Take care, GL

  40. Hero on 11/30/2006 at 6:44 pm

    Eric, you’d be wise to give up on American women, I’ve done that myself.

  41. Eric on 11/30/2006 at 7:18 pm

    Thank you Hero I already have they the whole feminist thing has brought them to close to the male side of things. Theres to much man woman and starting to find out if there single theres a reason

  42. George on 12/02/2006 at 3:39 pm

    Hiya;
    Great blog. I just wanted to say that it MUST be North American women who find it impossible to believe that a younger woman would be interested in an “old fart”. I say that because I’m 43, used to live in Canada and now live in Europe. I get all kinds of attention from younger women both here and back home when I visit. But in Canada, as soon as I let on that I’m 43 (I look young for my age) it’s like a complete shut down occurs. No way could a 20 year old see herself going out with some 43 year old. Not so here. It doesn’t even come up. Granted, I keep myself in shape, always act like a gentleman, and try to show my date a great time. I think in North America, it’s not so much that I’m too old to bother with. It’s more like they have some socially foistered taboo about age that they just don’t have over here. The women here are just sooo much more mature and in tune with reality rather than some hip music video, pseudo rationality that seems to have gripped the minds of most North American women (sorry, but it’s true). Not only do women over here see no reason to spurn an attractive, confident and mature lover, they’re actually proud of the fact that they can be with one. The impression I get from the younger women I’ve gone out with is that they feel pretty cool showing me off to their friends rather than embarressed. And it’s a two way street. I have so much more to offer than a guy her own age would.

  43. rw_man on 12/02/2006 at 7:05 pm

    Hi George,

    Thanks for joining us and sharing your valuable experiences with this comment. I’m very happy to hear that you are in the position that you are. Where are you living in Europe by the way?

    Cheers GL

  44. Hero on 12/02/2006 at 10:27 pm

    Hi George, I’m 38 and I’ve had the same experiences that you have. People tell me all the time that I look younger than my true age, but still, American women younger than 35 generally aren’t interested in me. But in the Philippines, Hungary, the Czech Republic, and Holland, young and pretty girls seem to like me just fine.

    Have you also noticed that more and more women in the U.S. are pursuing men much younger than themselves? I meet “Mrs. Robinsons” all the time.

  45. George on 12/03/2006 at 10:36 am

    Thanks for the warm welcome. I just noticed I’d spelt “embarrassed” wrong in my previous post – how embarrassing. :-/

    Rw_man, I live on a Greek island. Been here for awhile now and I’m really liking it. I think Greek girls are very similar to Russian girls in many respects but perhaps just a little more ‘Westernized’. I can say they are some of the most beautiful women on the planet and I’ve been to alot of places ( never been to Russia but I have been to Bulgaria). There seems to be this misconception in the west that beauty for a woman is the same as being seen as a sex object and somehow degrading. Nothing could be further from the truth. In my experiance beauty empowers a woman and comands respect and admiration from any decent man. I’d also like to add that I firmly believe true beauty is at least 50% attitude.
    Hero, I spent 2 years living in Holland and met some great people. Wonderful country and a very progressive society. I was your age at the time and was going out with a really nice girl who was 15 years younger than me. What I remember vividly is that the whole age thing was a much bigger hang-up for me than it was for her. I thought then – as I do now that, as an older partner in the relationship, I had to be extremely careful not to mislead her in any way. I think it’s about honesty and responsibility. She knew I didn’t want to get married and have children and I knew she eventually would. We parted as friends and we still are.
    Sorry to ramble on here but I was wondering if you guys agree with this belief I’ve always had that as men, we are in many ways accountable for the beauty of the women we are with. I mean to say that – women become radiant when they are with men who make them feel that way.

  46. rw_man on 12/03/2006 at 12:12 pm

    Thanks for the filling us in on what the Greek and Dutch ladies are like. Nice to know that there are other places were age is not a big hang-up. You are absolutely right in saying that in many cases age is an issue for Men more then it is for the Women they date. Just go with what works and that’s all anyone has to worry about. Please keep posting and please tell your friends about us while you are at it..

    Cheers GL

  47. Hero on 12/03/2006 at 5:00 pm

    Hi again George, yes Holland was great, it was too bad that I only got to spend 5 days there. One night I was just sitting around waiting for the trolley, and a gorgeous woman came up to me and asked ME out. We went to a jazz club named Bourbon Street, have you ever been there?

    Hmm.. are we accountable for the beauty of the women we’re with? Well, if you’re with a good woman, then yes. If you treat her well then she’ll appreciate it and she’ll be smiling all the time. Not only that, but she’ll repay your kindness by looking good for you. On the other hand, I’ve met plenty of American women whose husbands treat them like queens, and yet these women STILL cut their hair short and gain 50 pounds within 6 months of the wedding.

  48. Hero on 12/03/2006 at 5:01 pm

    P.S. I’ve only met one Greek woman in my life, but she was an absolute knockout. I haven’t seen her in seven years, but I still haven’t forgotten her and I don’t think that I ever will. I was amazed that she could dress sexy without looking trashy.

  49. George on 12/04/2006 at 10:23 am

    Yes Hero, granted the woman must be worth the effort. I’m not really sure what I’m trying to say here other than – if you want a decent woman, you have to be a decent guy.

  50. Tatiana on 01/02/2007 at 10:55 pm

    The much older man with a younger Russian woman is a myth. Any Russian woman will tell you that as soon as she can find a better, younger man she will take the advantage. Marriage Agency is a business. A business promoting foreign women, willing to leave their country for a husband and new life. Every dating/marriage agency on the web has their share of fairy tales about these May to December marriages How some young thing just adores her old, aging foreign husband. Be very careful when you see these kind of testimonials.

    If it was true, you would see a lot of these kinds of marriages in Russia. It is very seldom that you will meet a family or couple, where the husband is more than 3-5 years older. In fact, in Russia, people who are in the midst of trying to marry, are almost the same age, usually no more than a one – three year age difference.

    Human nature being what it is, we all want to believe in some for of magic and the advertising business attempts to use our belief in magical things happening to us very much to their advantage. This scenario of young Russian women wanting to meet and marry older men is no different than believing in the advertisements that there are magic pills to make you lose 20 pounds in 2 days, or some scheme to GET RICH in 24 hours.

    If you are interested in a Russian woman, at least be wise enough and choose a Russian woman who will match your life interests and your age. Don’t believe these advertisements that tell you that young Russian girls are happy to marry men much, much older than they are. Once there is no more advantage to be gained, the young girl will make a better choice of income.

  51. Hero on 01/03/2007 at 12:48 pm

    But Tatiana, how does a typical 25-year-old Russian man compare to a typical 40-year-old American man? A lot of middle-aged men in the USA take very good care of themselves and look much better than a typical 40-year-old Russian man. Besides, the 40-year-old American will have a lot more $$$ than the 25-year-old Russian.

  52. wonderlander on 01/03/2007 at 1:11 pm

    Tatiana hits the nail. It’s so embarrassing to see those “romance tour” photos of old and/or ugly Western guys with young local girls (some beautiful, some substandard). Guys look zonked with happiness they have been promised. Blind like mice, overwhelmed with pride and excitement. And the girls smiling near… Just Regularly Happy in Their Own Skin. Just Saying Cheese along with the National Picture-Taking Culture. Serving Decorations. Serving Precious Decorations. Confused. Ashamed. Embarrassed. Wry. Sly. Powerful. Contemptuous. Whoring and/or consummating (prevail). Choose one.

    Having still to post about the disgrace of those “tours” as a genre, I must highlight the following…

    Realistically, it’s early 30-40-years that is the Ripest Age to win ALL girls and ladies starting from 17. The 50-something men’s league is women well past their 30s… and yes these ladies are often VERY hot. (Otherwise, whom THESE women must get married to?!)

    Ok, she’s 20, you’re 50 and it looks a movie plot. NOW it’s great time. But does she expect to stay when she’s 30 vs.60? 40 vs.70? With women’s sexuality unfolding ca.30 (sometimes only after childbirth), and blazing ca.40 (did you know)?

    OK, there are world’s examples of grandfathering fathers. They are strong and brave, they feel attraction… but do they EVOKE enough?

    OK, emotional + spiritual + intellectual connectivity build a marriage (and, in our contemporary cultures, these can be ensured by an age difference… as well as hampered, with the generation of MTV and Vuitton). Yet sexual discords – can ruin it.

    Here occurs the striking impression of the worn faces of 80% Western grooms, even since their 30something. No detriment to gentlemen ca.50s looking late 30s. But…

    Would that budding bride like to be a widow with half her life yet to be lived? Or… might she EXPECT to?

    Isn’t it cruel to pick her blooming years and leave her past the dating fair? ESPECIALLY when love was there, and you’ve been her world? And isn’t it selfish to regard her as a future nurse?

    That birdie may be too naïve to think this – YOU the Strong Wise Decisionmaker shouldn’t be.

    Men before 45 are not “old”, they are deemed “mature”. But starting from your late 40s, 10-15 years of difference is NOT a “basic base”, it’s rather a BORDER between your Chance and Rejection, her Likes and Abuse. Especially when she has indicated her age brackets. Believe me, she HAS already been generous setting them. You can try stretch these brackets by 2-3 years more… but 5 is most probably too much.

    Sincerely,

    Your Devil’s Advocate Comrade Natalia (not the above one)

  53. Taras on 01/04/2007 at 2:20 am

    Believe me Natalia, most American men are not deluded into thinking a 40-something year old would have his pick of 22-year old Russian women. I for one would rather be with someone 10 years younger than me, because if I marry her, I would also want to have children too. The fact is, men often die 7 or 10 years younger than women do, if not a LOT sooner. I am 40 years old now, and if I didn’t have gray in my beard and hair, you might mistake me for a 30-year old.

    Taras

  54. wonderlander on 01/04/2007 at 8:07 am

    So, Taras, you represent that right minority against the “general mass” we see from our side too often. There are many 22-yearlings well-disposed to youthful 40+ers; yet if you only knew how many “worn” and “over-bracket” knock on our doors in vain.

    Disclaimer: I by no ways mean to make disrespect to anyone. I am very attracted to older men (platonically), ’cause we are at the same wavelength which is rare among younger people. My biggest friends approach 60 and 70 (Gentlemen) and 50 (a Lady). I am 28.

    Sincerely, N.

  55. wonderlander on 01/04/2007 at 12:26 pm

    BTW I know many 30+ mothers of healthy kids over here (including my own Grandmother!). Same as with men, it’s all about personal health, proper medical care, and maturity.

    Be it mentioned that Russian “later mothers” are ESPECIALLY affectionate, responsible and thinking ones, compared to those thousands of tamed youngsters (sure not all but prevailing), who bring kids into the world for fear of “being late”, for conformity to their environment’s expectation, for the goal of getting married, for spontaneous attitude to life, for the risks of the abortion alternative (this “oops” reason is VERY frequent), and serve their maternal duty with appeasement just inevitable (for natural feelings, for social ethics, and for self-rescuing discipline).

    Modern Russian brides and wives plan children after 25, aspire to fulfil the plan before 30, but see no tragedy in early 30s, given the considerations I’ve mentioned in the first paragraph.

  56. wonderlander on 01/04/2007 at 12:31 pm

    Oh yes and if she has born kids already, her fertility has got a powerful bio-restart.

  57. Hero on 01/04/2007 at 2:40 pm

    Still, the probability of a 40-year-old man finding a 22-year-old gf in the USA is zero, regardless of how youthful he looks. At least in Russia a middle-aged man who takes care of himself has a chance of winning the heart of a 22-year-old girl.

  58. rw_man on 01/04/2007 at 8:26 pm

    Tatiana and Wonderlander..

    You are both Distorting the Truth.

    It is COMMON for me to see older men in their 40′s and 50′s with younger women in their 20′s and 30′s here in Russia. No one Forced anyone to be a part of these relationships so cut the “Feminist Exploitation Garbage” out or this..

    The entire tone of your recent comments seem to be based on some perceived sense of shame over Older Men and Younger Women as opposed to actual demographic, economic and cultural reality which encourages these unions far more then opposes them.

    Any reader who carefully looks over both of your comments can see this.. your emotions over this sense of nationalistic or feminist’s shame is one thing.. the actual reality over here is different no matter how much you may want it to be other wise.

    Many woman that I see are faced with a complete zero sum game. In many cases it’s either a few years with someone or all years with NO ONE. So if you had your way you would prefer that these women have NO ONE as opposed to SOMEONE. Nice ladies.. real nice..

    Let’s let your ego get in the way of helping your sisters from finding some happiness in their lives..

    It’s funny because you may not support these unions.. but you obviously know how influential a Russian Woman’s Mother is with her daughters choice in Men..

    Do you REALLY think most of these mothers look at their lonely daughters and tell them NO I don’t want you to marry this guy because he’s too old for you????

    In the VAST majority of these cases you have a Woman’s own Mother endorsing these unions because she REALLY knows that the clock is ticking and she doesn’t want to see her daughter suffering often the same fate that she has been living through herself..

    If the VAST majority of their own mother’s support this then WHAT gives YOU the RIGHT to Dump on them or the Men who engage in this??

    I hope this isn’t the case.. BUT you may very well be in this situation yourself someday so be very careful what you criticize ladies..

    GL

  59. wonderlander on 01/05/2007 at 12:54 pm

    Oh Goodness… Your feminists have scared men into seeing them everywhere…

    GL, you show one faucet of reality, I just show another one next to it.

    If two people appear in public together, no stranger knows for sure what story stands behind them…

    There are REALLY MANY happy 20+ & 40+ couples, GREAT LESS squint looks on them, and UNDISPUTED TRUTH in your arguments

    (DISCLAIMER again: I feel like putting my signature to so many many of your posts, but express my accord in written only if it is telling people anything new…).

    On the OTHER hand, there are REALLY MANY deluded men and girls who exploit them (not vice versa). And it’s lack of critical reasoning on the one side, and excess of socialized prostitution on the other side, that have my… not even anger, RUE it is.

    You say nobody forces the girls… isn’t that their demographic & economic situation, as well as their mothers?

    You say I’m preventing my sisters’ happiness… wasn’t I promoting the generally and unjustly overlooked older women??? Do have compassion for THEM.

    Tatiana and I are on this blog; it means we are amidst the international dating reality. And it is like this…

    Dozens to hundreds new emails and contacts from men DAILY.

    Megabytes of information on the topic, first-hand impressions inclusive.

    And if you’re really interested in my case…

    My mother is one most popular and feminine woman in her environment (the National University), is convinced “better alone than with a wrong man” (had two not worst husbands, the last one is still trying to bring her back), measures any man on my way as a possible husband, pushes me however she could, yet her first question about any candidate is: “How old is he”, and, when the figure starts with 40, then the other anxious phrase is “Isn’t he too old?”

    Sorry if my truths can be interpreted as bragging, vanity or else again. Believe me, I don’t need that childish stuff for reassertion.

    Sincerely,
    Comrade Natalia

  60. wonderlander on 01/05/2007 at 1:11 pm

    ouch, a rather neurotic picture it looks, but getting me married is one thing that makes her nervous.

  61. Hero on 01/05/2007 at 1:52 pm

    Doesn’t your mother know that 40 is the new 30? There was a time when 40 was considered old, but these days there are a lot of 40-year-olds who look like kids.

  62. wonderlander on 01/05/2007 at 10:17 pm

    “fAcet”… please correct the misprint! (all blushed)))))

  63. Taras on 01/06/2007 at 3:25 pm

    I’ve been fooled by some of those 30 and 40-somethings. I once knew this lovely Vietnamese lady who everyone swore she was 20. She was very nice, cultured and well liked by everyone, and she was a very postive happy person. I was thunderstruck when she told me she was 33! When people take care of their health and live clean lives, they look younger than their years for a long, long time. Maybe age is more an attitude and what sort of life one’s living instead of merely how many miles you have on the odometer.

    Taras

  64. Ceiver on 01/06/2007 at 11:59 pm

    I’ve looked at those photos of older men with their young brides. The age thing doesn’t bother me. It’s the fact that the guys are out of shape.
    I’ve been “dating” a younger women (under 30) from eastern Europe. I’ve nursed her more than she has had to nurse me (zero). Still after all the attention i gave her, she did select a younger guy…for the green card and turned down the “real thing”.
    The older Russian women are definitely still attractive (36+). The maturity they display in how they maintain themselves, the spirit in their eyes, the happiness in their smiles is sensual (hot) in its own way. I’m not looking for a daughter or to be a father to a young woman. I’m looking for a partner.

  65. wonderlander on 01/07/2007 at 8:51 am

    Glad to hear you, Gentlemen.

    So is my usual reply to Mom – “No, HE is not” (if it weren’t for this particular man’s “youthful maturity”, he won’t have been mentioned to her))). I just wanted to prove that, together with this common and overwhelming motherly matrimonial concern, our mothers still are also worried about long-term prospects by the time when the reserve of male vitality may wither, as Taras underlined.

    Here I’d point out that most “typical” Russian mothers are first anxious to get a daughter married, and then to defend her happiness against what they dislike in her husband. This brings about many jokes. So, the more caution and less pressure at the bridal stage, the more chance for a happy lasting marriage (“better less, but better”).

    The other important idea to agree on, is that neither shall “passport age” prejudice be extended over women. I regret I’ve lost the original text of an essay about the contemporary generation of marriage-aged Russian women. It’s very insightful about typical patterns.

    Teens: “I’m worth as much as men like me. I live in prison of criticism and prohibitions. I must break free and take rebellious actions… and still bear a cannonball chained to my ankle.”

    20: “I’m God’s deputy on Earth. I’m heart-eater in love sphere. I’m chief super-duper expert in work sphere. I can everything!”

    25: “ First wrinkle! First pound! What a scarecrow I am. What a jerk he was. What a meaningless toil my work is.”

    27: “Who am I? What am I for?”

    [29 11/12: "ALARM!!!!"

    30.00: "So what? It's just a figure no one believes. A woman is as old as she looks and feels."]

    30s. “Now I know. I’ve managed my physique and style, attained satisfaction and respect in work sphere, secured and fuelled the fire of my heart, and share light and warmth without grudge.”

    Here come all those beautiful, hot, wise, confident-tolerant and tolerant-confident women, who’ve inventorized their aspirations and qualities, sanated liabilities into assets, and stand ready, willing and able for a mutually beneficial merger (excuse me for the economic terminology, since it’s authorized by the Respected Host, as well as many humorous observations on love matters).

    Again, it’s not an imperative rule (zakon), just a trend (zakonomernost).

    Sincerely,
    Comrade Natalia

  66. Ceiver on 01/08/2007 at 12:08 am

    Natalia,
    Since my last international “affair” with a younger woman, I would joke to my friends that someone your age would be too old for me. But tis a joke..
    Age is a canvas. Heart and spirit have no age, so i look for maturity, understanding, mutual respect and common values.

  67. wonderlander on 01/08/2007 at 12:20 am

    Exactly.

  68. Dana on 01/09/2007 at 1:29 pm

    This blog is one of the saddest I have seen in a while. I am a bi-national, American and German female living in Paris. Where incidentally, there happens to be many beautiful women as well. But what this blog is really about is one man’s insecurity. I do find that some American women are a bit, um…”odd”. But this, this blog, is full of anti-women, childish bullshit.

    I am a Phd, American and beautiful, if you don’t believe me, email me…

  69. kzarz on 01/09/2007 at 5:53 pm

    Dana,

    I don’t beleive you. Please send a link so the members can decide for themselves.

  70. rw_man on 01/09/2007 at 7:20 pm

    Hello Again Dana..

    You know what a REAL Demonstration of Desperation is?

    It’s your need for negative attention by coming on to this blog with your (yawn) slander..

    It’s pretty clear you feel the need to do that because that’s all you’ve got in your little “I’m so smart and beautiful” life toots..

    Well we aim to please here so let me give you what you came for..

    No matter how much you try to impress us with your Phd title it still doesn’t cover up for the fact that you are one seriously bigoted, arrogant and ignorant fool. Oh and let me guess you live in Paris because you are flaming Socialist too..

    Have fun trying to find a Real Man.. oh wait you can’t.. so that’s why you have to come to this blog where we hang out and try to slam us instead because you sure as hell can’t get us to be with you..

    Make’s perfect sense..

    So in my best Monty Python voice..

    “Go away or I will taunt you for a 2nd time..”

    Either that or grow some real brains and offer us a REAL Debate with REAL Substance..

    I stand ready and willing..

    What about you?

  71. Babalugatch on 01/19/2007 at 9:13 pm

    The issue of age difference is a complicated issue. Here in America, at one time it was quite common for a man to marry a woman 20 years his junior. With the advent of feminist poison, which was designed as a wedge between men and women, women in America fail to get married at all. American women either practice serial monogamy or promiscuity until they are well into their thirties, even when they feel they feel the biological call to reproduce their feminist programming still puts them at odds with the pool of men they have to chose from. Moreover, attractive women in their late thirties of 40′s are often looking for men that are 10 to 15 years YOUNGER then they are. If you don’t believe me look at the numerous American personals websites. Now I’m not going to be hypocritical and say there is something morally or intrinsically wrong with a 40 year old woman marrying a 25 year old man. But, try as you may, you feminists cannot overcome nature or biology. A 25 year old man is not going to take a 40 year old woman seriously as a bride or the mother of his children. Biologically speaking she has limited value to him in that regards. He is very much likely only to view her as a partner for sexual release.

    To the issue of older men and younger women in Russia: I’d say American men have to be realistic. Be realistic in your evaluation of yourself. If you are 40 and have a beer belly don’t think that 20 year old hottie is interested in you because she digs you. If you are in your 40′s don’t look any younger that a woman that is more than 15 years younger than you and that’s if you have kept yourself in shape and your stomach flat. If you have maintained yourself physically and dress nicely you can find a woman 10-15 years younger than yourself here also, if that’s what you want. If you are in your 40′s and look like Brad Pitt I’d still say you are foolish looking at 22 year olds. If you are 60, you are foolish if you are looking at women in their thirties. If you are in you thirties look for women older than 25. Also, take into consideration the individual. Don’t ignore any red flags because of their beauty. Be careful and ascertain their motives.

  72. Hero on 01/19/2007 at 10:03 pm

    Babalugatch said:

    “Moreover, attractive women in their late thirties of 40’s are often looking for men that are 10 to 15 years YOUNGER then they are. If you don’t believe me look at the numerous American personals websites. Now I’m not going to be hypocritical and say there is something morally or intrinsically wrong with a 40 year old woman marrying a 25 year old man. ”

    Yeah, I noticed that too! What’s the deal with all these “Mrs. Robinsons”??

    I think it’s perverse for a woman to want to marry or even to date a much younger man, though. Is she so desperate to control her husband that she’ll marry a guy who considers her a substitute mommy? Or does she just want a trophy to make her friends jealous? And besides, women have a biological clock and their fertility begins to decline when they’re 27; a man can father children well into his 50′s, and sometimes beyond. So clearly, it’s more natural for a man to marry a woman who’s 15 years younger than he is than the reverse.

    Babalugatch also said:
    “If you have maintained yourself physically and dress nicely you can find a woman 10-15 years younger than yourself here also”

    Sorry, I disagree. I almost never observe that phenomenon here. I know a lot of men who are middle-aged but fit and successful, and practically all are married to cows. I swear, I look at those couples and wonder if the guy is out with his wife or his mother.

  73. Babalugatch on 01/19/2007 at 10:15 pm

    Hero stated:
    Sorry, I disagree. I almost never observe that phenomenon here. I know a lot of men who are middle-aged but fit and successful, and practically all are married to cows. I swear, I look at those couples and wonder if the guy is out with his wife or his mother.

    I agree also. More often than not these men are with American women they married when they were young and she has been planted to the couch consuming carbs and smoking cigarettes. Maybe they are just not in the market for a fairly younger wife who still looks good. American women have a tendency to get real large real quick, for the most part.

  74. Hero on 01/19/2007 at 10:33 pm

    It makes me wonder why those men even bother keeping themselves fit. It blows my mind when some guy gets up at 5:00 AM every morning for a 5 mile run, while his wife spends the whole day sitting on her butt and stuffing her face.

  75. OldFool on 01/22/2007 at 12:05 am

    My father was 15 years older than my mother (who died 5 yrs after him), it was a lifelong happy marriage and of course I considered this the norm.
    Regarding Natalia the 1st and Dana, I can’t accept the aggressive, belittling and patronizing answers they received, to drive them out. What they said is valuable, even if it raises disagreement. Plus, they are women. And I’m sure Dana doesn’t boast stupidly about her PhD, she got used to it years ago, she just doesn’t want to be brushed off as an ignorant, uneducated girl.
    And I disagree with you, Dana, all there is here is not bullshit, let’s say perhaps half of it? but it leaves very interesting comments and opinions. May I add that 10 yrs I realized ago that I belonged to a sexual minority, as some other men here I noticed, the men who love women.
    Now my problem is, my friend told me when she turned 60, and me 66, that she wasn’t interested any more, however passionate she had been until then. And it is impossible to put an ad disclosing that I am 73, so direct contact is the only possible approach. Thus I met a charming young lady who was also using the car to walk the dog, and …

  76. Hero on 01/22/2007 at 9:29 pm

    You’re 73 and still chasing girls?! High five, sir!

  77. peter on 01/28/2007 at 6:17 pm

    I find this intersting, I have a friend in china and we chat now and again and she asked me, why can there be such an age gap between men and women? She said men always seem to want an youger woman, and many younger women seem so attracted to older men (you insert whatever age gap you would like).

    So I gave her my opinion. To and extent men do like younger women for their smooth clear skin, their youthful exhuberence and zest for life. As opposed to cynicism and leathered skin from suntanning trying to look young.

    Yes younger women, now not all younger women, do like the maturity and the stability of an older man.

    Now if a man finds a woman he wants, and I use the term wants as in a trophy on his arm and does not use good judgement then he gets what deserves. As in all ages of life people will take advantage of you if you let them.

    I have received emails from women as young as 19. Now lets see what problems could occur? 1st and foremost I am 49. Do I have any moral issues? No. Could she really want a man my age? Yes some really truly do.

    However using some sane thougts. My youngest is 22 years old. I myself do not want to change diapers again. So when going to internet dating sites you have to use some of your “maturity” when deciding to send an email to someone.

    I have exchanged emails with a woman that is 32. Looks wise on a scale of 1 to 10 she would be oh roughly 1000. We really have formed quite a nice realtionship, but. Now this is a big but, she wants another child.

    So a little common sense says it will not work.

    I am a firm believer in age is just a number. If there is a connection on all levels then so be it.

    It is not for me or anyone else to judge other people.

    There is a saying and I know it is true.

    Man was given 2 heads but only enough blood to think with one at a time. Try using the correct head.

    laterzzzzzzzzzzzzz

  78. bronei on 03/23/2007 at 3:07 am

    No fool like an old fool!! And let’s not forget men peak say about 20 years old and women at 40. So when your young honey gets to fourty and your about 100, let’s hope she get’s her rocks off on some good looking young toy boy..mmmmm

  79. rw_man on 03/23/2007 at 4:14 pm

    bronei..

    Likewise.. No Hag like and old Hag..

    Especially one who is just another jealous liar like yourself and tries to grossly exaggerate and spin what I’m saying in this blog with 60 year age differences.

    Trying to snag boy toys is the only thing left for you eh?

  80. Craig on 03/24/2007 at 4:18 am

    “No fool like an old fool!! And let’s not forget men peak say about 20 years old and women at 40. So when your young honey gets to fourty and your about 100, let’s hope she get’s her rocks off on some good looking young toy boy..mmmmm”

    Yet another insightful and constructive comment. NOT!

    Amazing how someone can lay bare the emptiness and desperation of their own life in a few simple words.

    I suppose now we can expect a vigorous defense consisting of 1) “I’m very attractive” 2) “I’m not fat” 3) “I have lots of friends” 4) “I have lots of degrees” 5) “My boyfriend/husband/lesbian lover loves me for who I am” 6) … ah, who cares

  81. Ceiver on 03/24/2007 at 1:11 pm

    I’m sure when I’m 100 I’ll still be able to satisfy two or three 40 year olds. And we will all have breakfast together. So what’s the problem.

  82. Hero on 03/24/2007 at 1:53 pm

    Bronei, are you one of those pathetic middle-aged women who goes chasing after men who are 15 years younger than you? Or, God forbid, one of those predatory schoolteachers who seduces 14-year-old boys?

  83. wonderlander on 03/26/2007 at 10:05 am

    Hi guys!

    Let’s remove the prejudice of Western standards that have been your eyesores, and observe the pool of 40+ women Eastward – what stories happen there?

    Assume she is originally beautiful (Russian genes), well-preserved (modern industry), traditional (social upbringing) and balanced (better laugh than cry).

    What if her husband has swapped her for a younger one? You know, we have a true “natural circulation” in the Former Soviet Union climate:
    1. Stay bachelor, OR marry a peer-ager.
    2. Marry OR remarry a young chick.
    Question: where are the discarded wife items lost?

    Or she was married to an older man, and widowed?

    Or her previous man was a failure (in terms of attitude, personality, achievement, any other)? No matter, whether it was a marriage, a concubinage, or a hard pursuit of a Good Man.

    Now assume she feels sufficient with her earnings (big or small – it’s all the matter of attitude), and thus isn’t pressed for a “provider”.

    Even if she were, why in the world shall she set her brackets for a man of advanced age? Everybody prefers tight skin, unpained back and heart, optimistic spirit, whatever you see in young girls. Re-read the thread, with all that indignation at women trying to prevent men from choosing whom they want…

    Yes, social stereotypes. They harness her head to toes, when she meets Him.

    Assume there is a young man reaching 30, which is the age of scoring and settling. By that age, it is clear if the man is going to succeed or not, ripe to marry or not, learned how to treat a woman or not.

    By this landmark, a man is expected to have a career if not his own business, a car, a wife, a kid, and naturally some home to live (earned, loaned, given or shared by his or her parents / grandparents). Not at all fantastic, as my pals prove. (Not to mention the Google boys. Born successful, early successful.)

    Some guys are missing the family part, though. Too occupied with his occupation. Or too vexed with the “DJ generation” of girls he has nothing to talk about with.

    But back to our couple. He is a chiropractic.

    What actions would you rather approve in a lady? Staying alone, not expecting anything good of the remaining life? Chasing “the older, the richer”?

    Or giving her heart to the “poor but honest guy”? Who can cater for himself if not for a family, though. And is nothing like gigolo, as you might have thought.

    Who is the first to treat her as a Woman – not as his mother, like her (older!) ex used to.

    Who loves her for herself, not for his propagation plan. Strangely enough. But shall we deny happiness to couples who have children, who can’t have children, or who don’t want them, or rely on God’s disposition?

    The more we judge, the harder it is to find a person on Earth who 100% qualifies for love and (what a crime!) sex.

    Sincerely,
    Comrade N.

  84. Surfer on 03/26/2007 at 12:14 pm

    Life is tougher. Lets not make it tougher than it has to be. ok :)

  85. Ceiver on 03/27/2007 at 4:07 am

    ok when I’m 100 I can get by with 2 65 year olds. I’ll give each one a day off to catch up on rest.

    One of the biggest problems in the senior retirement homes/villages in Florida is STDs. Have grandma explain herself.

  86. Ceiver on 03/27/2007 at 4:19 am

    to Wonderlander

    Only a blind man (prejudice men are blind) would not see the beauty of maturity and personality in the women you describe. Such passion they bring to those who appreciate them for who they are.

  87. Anthony on 08/12/2007 at 11:25 pm

    I have to admit I am a fan of Russian, eastern block women actually most Europeans. Like in all races there are good and bad, but I feel the strength of the European women in general makes her not group with other women angered by there life mistakes (mainly screwing everyone and getting hard and blaming men for everything. I find Europeans more mature, less full of themselves and useful. These north American women who continually slam men forget they live in a country created and defended by men, work primarily for businesses owned by men and I think most of them say there independent etc, but in the end us men provide basics for living. Whets so Ironic is in the more we make excuses for women, lower the standard for women. Have to call them big bones when really they are just lazy gluttons, the lower the quality of the women in every sense. North Americans are fatter, dress poorly, lack class, lazy, cannot even keep a house, don’t cook, talk stupid basically useless.

    I own a large business. I put more trust in a level headed European doing a job then a north American who does little, but wants to be credited for something she has not earned. My advise to men take a European. Looks better, talks smarter, has culture, takes better care of herself and less risk of divorce and you losing everything.

    P.S. R.W I like your style

  88. Tom on 08/21/2007 at 8:31 pm

    Folks…I married a 44 year old Tartar woman when I was 72 and we both are extremely happy, and love and respect each other.
    We act like teenagers and enjoy every minute together..and we wouldn’t have it any other way. Both of us are givers and caretakers and it reflects in every second of our lives together.
    We cannot do enough for each other and one another’s happiness is paramount to both of us.
    I wish that everyone could experience a love like we have…it is indescribable..the happiness and joy is like a heaven on earth.
    Don’t look at the calendar just follow your heart…you will never regret it !
    And don’t listen to the trashtalkers…Russian women are the creme de la creme..they are intelligent, beautiful, caring, kind and independent. In general..the Russian women have more desirable character traits than other woman…the best kept secret is the regal Tartar woman..all I can say is they are beyond your wildest imagination in all things feminine.

    The Happiest Octogenarian !

  89. DeWayne on 08/26/2007 at 3:51 pm

    I love this blog! I run a website where I do some crazy movie reviews. One of my reviews was about the horror movie “HOSTEL” and the Russian women in the movie were jaw-dropping gorgeous!

    I liked what Anthony in the post above stated about the differences between Russian women and American women. From my personal experiences with visiting some night clubs in my past and dancing with a young women from Europe, I can honestly say I would prefer a Russian woman!

    I noticed immediately, that this young Russian woman had a very cool attitude and was fun-loving, which may not be true in all cases, but I was highly impressed.

    My view is this. Do alot of research. Alot of Googling! Get to know a Russian woman and try it out. What do you have to lose? Ok, you might lose an American woman. Oops!

    DeWayne
    MovieDownloadMatrix.com
    Movies That Bite Back!

  90. Rexpat on 08/26/2007 at 6:09 pm

    I was born on Cape Breton Island, Nova Scotia, Canada. I’m leaving in a couple of weeks for Russia and to be with my Russian girl.

    Yesterday I had a conversation with a man who was having some guilt thoughts about being incredibly attracted to a girl about 23. He’s 46 and in relatively good shape. Yes, she made a pass at him. He’d already spoken with three other local men who are all at least 20 years older than their girlfriends in successful relationships.

    Why do Real girls love men much older than themselves? Mostly it’s due to their man being a Real man. Many times this can take many years to arrive at this point. And with regard to Russian girls and due to the huge respect I have for them I wrote the following…

    http://russianlove.wordpress.com/2007/08/22/real-men-only-need-apply/

    DeWayne… Do you know any movies which feature dysfunctional boys whose idea of a personal life is the use of prostitutes, sex tours and blowup dolls and who ooze hatred and loathing instead of charm and charisma… as opposed to a life with the world’s most beautiful and feminine girls?

    I have an idea for a script….

  91. rw_man on 08/26/2007 at 7:56 pm

    Hi DeWayne,

    Thanks for the cool comments :) Although I admit that I never imagined that the horror movie Hostel would somehow lead you down this road to discovery ;)

    Since you are into movies I’d highly recommend that you watch and review Dr. Zhivago for more insight and possible inspiration. I personally found the movie to be very accurate from my own experience with these incredible ladies.

    Cheers!

    GL

  92. DeWayne on 08/27/2007 at 3:43 am

    My pleasure! I rarely blog, but your blog really caught my eye and I think it will be of a great help to any guy, trying to make a decision about choosing a Russian wife.

    I had found a site some time back that I have seen online for years. I wanted to know your thoughts on it. I have read a great deal of the information on this site and it is quite good, but I always like a second opionion.

    The site is called womenrussia.com

    Please tell me what you think about this site. Thanks again!

    Cheers!

    DeWayne

  93. Hero on 08/28/2007 at 1:17 am

    DeWayne, womenrussia.com (aka Elena’s models) is a total rip-off. The quality of the women there has gone WAY downhill in the past few years. Seems like there’s nothing there but single moms and 30-somethings with baby rabies. They’re not even that good-looking.

    You asked “What do you have to lose?” The answer is thousands of dollars, your sanity, your freedom, and possibly your life. Forget the internet and just go over there. My plan is to move to Germany so that I can be closer to those lovely ladies and have four weeks of vacation per year to visit them. :-)

  94. DeWayne on 08/28/2007 at 3:47 am

    I like your thinking Hero!

    You make a good point by going over there, because then you get to see the real deal. Unfornately, the internet has plenty of rip-offs!

    You have a “good strategy” and you can normally get a good feel for what a woman is like when you meet her. The key here is “meeting” a Russian woman in her enviroment. Also, getting to know a woman over the internet is taking a tremendous risk. Good sound advice Hero!

    Thanks Hero!

    DeWayne :)

  95. Hero on 08/28/2007 at 1:47 pm

    Danke DeWayne! You’re too kind.

    Keep posting!

  96. socon on 08/30/2007 at 8:18 am

    Apologies if this is a duplicate…

    [1/2]

    Interesting thread. Never read it before since it doesn’t apply to me. It does bring up a few interesting issues, though:

    1. Notice the level of English of the “Russian Women” who are anti-older-men (Natasha-Natalia, Irina, Tatiana) versus that of those who favour it (Ekaterina, Wonderlander to some extent) The former seem to speak(type) the Queen’s English, while the latter’s posts are typical of non-native-language-speakers I can only conclude that the anti-older-men group are either:

    (a) ultra-Westernised RWs; or
    (b) WWs masquerading as RWs.

    I should add that I have no vested interest in this debate either way – I’m 24.

    2. This is an issue of concern: Many RWs come from broken homes. In the West, a girl who had an absentee / abusive father raises HUGE RED FLAGS. They are more likely to be bitter, have identity issues, be promiscuous(seeking attention from boys/men) , engage in self-destructive behaviours such as alcoholism, drugs, etc, etc, etc. So, my question is: Does the the psychology of RWs from broken homes differ significantly from that of those raised in the West? And if so, how, and why? Insights from GL, Wonderlander and others would be most interesting.

  97. socon on 08/30/2007 at 8:20 am

    [2/2]

    3. I have also noticed the “Cougar” / “Mrs Robinson” phenomenon here (in SA) in the last few years. Happens to me all the time. And I look nothing like Ashton Kutcher — FAR from it. This behaviour is creepy & borderline traumatic.

    Also, notice how these women try to impress you in conversation by throwing in information about their degrees/great careers/expensive house or car that they own, etc. The younger ones do the same thing, except its grades/ extracurriculars/career aspirations, etc. MEN do this to impress WOMEN. Not the other way around. If a woman lacks character, morals, femininity, domestic skills (and possibly fertility), I couldn’t care less about her degrees and money. LOL. It’s actually kinda sad that they’ve been led to believe that Men are impressed by these things. We’re not. And we’re not “threatened” by your “independence” either. It’s just not a big deal for us either way, it’s nowhere near high on our list of what we’re looking for in a partner.

    4. Wonderlander’s comment on the “typical patterns” in the lives of contemporary Russian girls (#65) is disturbing. The patterns in all age groups below 30 are pretty much indistiguishable from those we see in Western girls. I think (or rather, hope) that these trends are mostly present only in the biggest cities such as Kiev and Moscow

  98. socon on 08/30/2007 at 9:35 am

    Grr @ this thing

    [1.1 / 2]
    Interesting thread. Never read it before since it doesn’t apply to me. It does bring up a few interesting issues, though:

    1. Notice the level of English of the “Russian Women” who are anti-older-men (Natasha-Natalia, Irina, Tatiana) versus that of those who favour it (Ekaterina, Wonderlander to some extent) The former seem to speak(type) the Queen’s English, while the latter’s posts are typical of non-native-language-speakers I can only conclude that the anti-older-men group are either:

    (a) ultra-Westernised RWs; or
    (b) WWs masquerading as RWs.

    I should add that I have no vested interest in this debate either way – I’m 24.

  99. rw_man on 09/03/2007 at 7:52 pm

    Hi Socon,

    You’ve written quite a bit in the previous 3 posts but the main point I want to answer is the common mistake that Western Men have in their thinking when they try to compare a typical Russian Women to the various experiences they’ve had with a Western Woman (this is in regards to your question relating to many Russian Girls coming from broken homes that is..)

    Let me just start by saying this..

    Suffering while maintaining a sense of dignity about it is a major major part of the Russian Soul.

    Russian history is pretty messed up when it comes to the level of suffering that people had to continually go through.

    In short what I’m trying to say is this..

    The pain threshold that a typical Russian Woman has in relation to her ability to still function as a normal member of her family and of society is EXTREMELY high.

    What this means is that the vast majority of Russian women who come from broken homes treat this standard behavior as the norm..

    And believe me it seems that at least 50% of the Russian ladies I have seen have been through a family split up when they were kids.

    Therefore these women tend to cherish a real and responsible man in their lives and NOT lash out against him and try to turn him into a scapegoat which is so often the case in the US and the west.

    Socon don’t make the major mistake that I see so many other guys make in trying to fit a Russian Woman into the feminist experience that you were brought up in.

    You are dealing with 2 very different types of women..

    Let me repeat that again..

    You are dealing with 2 VERY Different Types of Women..

    And I say that in the most positive way you can imagine.

    I know this may be hard for you to fathom and even harder for you to adjust your actions to..

    But it’s the truth..

    And the only way you can start to understand is to find a short cut through the intellectualizing process that we all try to do when we start out on this journey and to just hop on a plane.. come over and experience for yourself what this truly feminine energy and vibe is all about.

    Just be glad that you are staring your search towards this direction at the age of 24 and just roll with it..

    Cheers..

    GL

  100. gonzo888 on 09/05/2007 at 10:14 am

    what a topic lots of debate going on. Well, as an experienced, educated and mature man I can say the following :
    –An older man can be better because he is more stable emotionally, psychologically, even spiritually.
    –Men usually are not ready for marriage before 30 y/o. We are not mature early, that is why more than 50% of young marriages end in divorce in the USA.
    –Also what was mentioned already, men need to prepare in a career, study, etc before marriage
    –Men are usually dumb at treating women before age 30 as well, we are egotistic, self centered, etc. One starts learning this skill after a number of girlfriends, failed relationships, etc
    –Younger guys are always more unfaithful because of the reasons just mentioned, inmaturity and selfishness.
    –Women who divorce a young man usually look otherwise after that (for an older guy), they simply know these facts.
    –Also as someone said, we over 40 are survivors,we have proven to overcome many obstacles,
    –Russian women are very pretty and a better value for a western man because as someone said,
    they are smarter to value a man as opposed to american women who think they are worth too much and don’t even know how to cook, are plain lazy and unfaithful
    –and very certain, a man does not value as first priority : a woman’s educational titles, career, “inteligence” nor her lineage, nor money, we value : physical beauty, sweetness of character, a docil, smart (knows how to be sexy
    and treat a man) and loving woman. And sorry to say it, but in that order. (we’re talking truth here). Other strong assets are : she cooks and she administers money wisely.
    –So : yeah, who cares is she has a PHD? not me, do you guys?
    –I want a pretty face, sweet character, nice butt and loyal and faithful female.
    –And yes, a nice butt is better than a PHD.
    –Ok, some would say a nice pair of tits is better.
    –And yes, a beautiful sexy 35 y/o woman is better also than a skinny boney 20 y/o or a fatty 19 y/o. (hint: get in shape ladies)
    –It is not our fault ladies, we were “wired” that way, that’s the nature of men.
    –And please don’t say I’m sexist, I’m just shedding some light on this topic, for the advantage of ALL of us who read this.
    –And also for the guys : as someone said; try to be wise, just get the best you can without being foolish, age difference is ok if we can fairly afford it, that is if your appearance is not greater than 15-20 years, that is if I look 35 then I can get a 20 y/o girl but not if I look 50. wouldn’t be wise to fool ourselves.
    –The phenomenon of older women seeking boys just indicates a decadent socity, just confirms that western woman are out of wisdom and commom sense and are sold out to narcicism and sluttiness. A woman doing such is just someone who feels she doesn’t need direction nor protection from a man, feels she is the leader and ruler of her man and house, this very thing goes against The Bible, which tells us the man should lead and protect her wife. I’m not saying men are superior, we are equally valuable, just different and suited each one for it’s role.
    –I love you all, these are just facts don’t be offended

  101. Hero on 09/07/2007 at 12:19 am

    Gonzo said: “a nice butt is better than a PHD.”
    :lol: You’re a wise man, Gonzo

  102. socon on 09/08/2007 at 8:00 pm

    GL: Thanks for the response, I’ll try to internalise it :)

    -

    gonzo888: Agree on all points. Don’t be too hard on the younger guys tho; I’ve known more sane, adequately mature younger guys than girls in the same age group. (Had to throw that in…)

  103. Ekaterina on 10/07/2007 at 3:07 am

    Hello all!

    I am a 28 year old russian girl who came to the states when I was 24 to marry an American man of age 38. My husband was very kind and loving and he do everything for me! so sweet!

    Eventually I get used to living here, and I am told I am quite pretty, and many men try to flirted with me. Most I ignore and my husband was not jealous. I did my best and stay with him for 1 years, but unfortunately I meet someone else and fall deeply in love. I feel so gueelty and he told me it will not work since my new love is too young (24) and only a med student, but I have been in love 3 years already and I am pregnant with our first child and extremely happy – it just feels right to share the same stages of our live together. I could not feel this with my ex husband. I also had very low sex attraction to the 38 year old man, unlike my current husband.

    Anyway, my advice is this: please make sure to speak with your woman about what you expect in a committment. Flirting for young girls can lead us astray, we do not know the world of marriage or what we want so much as experienced men. We come to country with more money and it is like being child in a candy store as they say. Also, the American boys are persistent! Please forgive me Andy if you are reeding this!

    xx
    Katia

  104. rw_man on 10/07/2007 at 5:20 am

    Hello Katya,

    Thanks for sharing your experience and most importantly your honesty with us.

    I certainly do not judge or fault you since I understand that matters of the heart are not so simple.

    More importantly I can see that you are trying with this post to reach out and to give some advice to the men here and I appreciate that.

    I know that your story is not the only one out there and that even with the best of intentions no one can predict how a marriage will play out.

    I think if this situation were reversed and Men were faced with a myriad of choices in Women who found him to be attractive then I also think it would be a difficult and tempting situation for them as well.

    Thanks again for your post.

    GL

  105. socon on 10/07/2007 at 10:50 am

    “Flirting for young girls can lead us astray, we do not know the world of marriage or what we want so much as experienced men. We come to country with more money and it is like being child in a candy store as they say. Also, the American boys are persistent! Please forgive me Andy if you are reeding this!”

    This is typical of permissive and debauched cultures of the West. Historical Determinism and all of that.

    Which is why it’s best to leave.

  106. socon on 10/07/2007 at 10:52 am

    “I certainly do not judge or fault you since I understand that matters of the heart are not so simple.” (GL)

    GL, commitment is a very, very simple concept indeed.

    I will judge her and fault her until the cows come home.

  107. Taras on 10/07/2007 at 9:09 pm

    Good point Ekaterina. However, many men here myself included want nothing to do with western women because they are always looking for a “better deal.” As they sow, so shall they reap. The “American boys” you refer to are nothing but players looking for easy sex, and care nothing for you or the damage they cause. I was married once, and I too could have cheated on my wife who was doing just that behind my back, but I didn’t because two wrongs don’t make a right. Your first husband could well have been a guy like me, and you don’t have any idea apparently the anger and bitterness going astray can leave behind.

  108. Luke Skywalker on 10/08/2007 at 1:26 am

    GL, commitment is a very, very simple concept indeed.

    I will judge her and fault her until the cows come home.

    Yeah, and I’m going to judge her and fault her too. Because you know what?

    There is this thing in the USA and the West that says that women have pretty much NO obligation to honor any of their commitments, and it’s blatantly obvious that she took advantage of that.

    And you know what? I’ve been listening to MRA’s that have been saying that marriage is just a way for women to get free money from men, and therefore it needs to be abolished. And I’m WITH those MRA’s because men need to be free. They don’t need to be shackled to women who see them as walking ATM’s and screw them over, and all the man gets is a “Please forgive me” (Ekaterina’s quote to her original husband) at the end.

    I hope that she knows that this “candy store” is going to be closed down real soon in the USA. Maybe it’ll still be open in other parts of the West. But it’s going to get closed down in the USA if it’s the last thing I do.

  109. Luke Skywalker on 10/08/2007 at 5:51 am

    I think I need to clarify here before my haters grab on this as another opportunity to bash me.

    When I said that I agreed with some other MRA’s that “marriage needs to be abolished”, I had in mind my home country, the USA. In countries where it is working, it obviously can be kept.

    In the USA marriage is blatantly being used by women to treat men as walking ATM’s, and to provide a “candy store” for women, as was mentioned by Ekaterina.

    There needs to be a moratorium on marriage in the USA until feminism is gone and the system is fixed.

  110. JM on 10/08/2007 at 6:46 am

    I agree with GL that Katia is trying to give us some important advice, and I think it’s something we should keep in mind when some young hottie professes her undying love for us.

    But, for the sake of Katia’s child, I hope her husband remembers his commitments 15 years from now when young ladies are vying for the good doctor’s attention. I would hate for the innocent child to have to bear the burden of Katia’s karmic lesson. As they say: what goes around, comes around.

  111. rw_man on 10/08/2007 at 12:44 pm

    Hi JM,

    Thanks for emphasizing that point.

    It’s a whole new ballgame commitment wise for Katya now that she’s got a little one on the way.

    Whatever issues in the past she’s had with her ex-husband now go to the back of the class and hopefully time will resolve it.

  112. Ceiver on 10/08/2007 at 3:48 pm

    Katya’s experience is another reason to consider old fashion courtship, especially when either person is young.

  113. socon on 10/08/2007 at 4:10 pm

    In civilized societies (Western Society post-60s is uncivilized/de-civilized) there are certain social norms/mores in place, which are most conducive to the perpetuating the greatest good for the greatest number. These norms include Patriarchy, sexual restraint, Heterosexual Monogamy, and others, collectively referred to as Natural Law. These norms occur, within a few degrees of freedom, in civilised societies across historical, cultural, and geographical boundaries. And these social norms are often reflected in/reinforced by the Laws of the society in question.

    In a truly civilized society, the probability of such an occurrence as this would be much, much, much, lower than in the modern West, because:

    [1] Flirting with a married woman is considered socially unacceptable, and subject to social sanction,
    [2] Stealing another man’s wife is considered socially unacceptable, and subject to social (and possibly legal/civil) sanction.

    I can tell from her tone that this individual, Katia, had the best of intentions. Unlike Western-raised girls, who seem to imbibe evil with their mother’s milk, or formula, or whatever. However, in a Western-Urban-Liberal society, even the best can succumb to falling by the wayside(observe Luke’s recent shenanigans as another example of this.) You cant take your “slice of heaven” to Hell, and expect it not to burn up. Which is why we should leave the Western-Urban-Liberal Societies to their own devices. Leave the feminists, manginas, gays, criminals, junkies, liberals, and other losers and scum… and see how long they last.

    The fact that we understand Katia’s situation (and, realise that, given the present state of Western society, it was rather inevitable) does not excuse it. That would be consistent with the behaviour of Liberals.

    Even if we understand the background of a serial murderer, and the factors that led to his actions, we still hang him high (or ought to). Unless we are Liberals. Conservative Laws and Mores are not so much about intent, morality, or even punishment, as they are about pragmatically maintaining the greatest good for the greatest number.

    Judgement/shaming is a useful way of maintaining stability and morality in society. Observed throughout history. The masses may not understand it, but it is an effective way of regulating society. Non-judgementalism, etc. is, again, consistent with the behaviour of the amoral & ignorant and naive people (liberals).

    “In the USA marriage is blatantly being used by women to treat men as walking ATM’s” (Luke)

    Pre-nups are romantic. Though not enough. Ask your lawyer or accountant for info. about creating a suitable corporate entity for your excess wealth, which your wife will not be able to touch. Also, DNA testing immediately after each child is born.

  114. Doamna on 10/09/2007 at 2:07 pm

    Socon, good man. I found myself nodding along with all statements of your last post until I froze from reading that:
    1. prenups are romantic, but not romantic enough.
    2. excess wealth should be kept under lock and key, like the dead wives in Bluebeard’s castle. just be sure never to make Bluebeard’s mistake of giving your wife the key to that closet.
    3. and most touching, immediately after your child has entered the world, before the placenta leaves your wife’s body, the child should be tested to be sure that yes, in fact, you are the father.
    Chilling, positively chilling, considering that the theme of this site is to find a good woman and to be a good man to that woman as long as you both live. Or am I mistaken? My impressions of this site is that it’s purpose is to enable men to find good women who want to begin families that last for generations; based upon two people committed to giving their lives to beginning something beautiful in a world so full of the monstrous, and enjoying what they’ve made for their remaining days. In other words, a traditional family, such as the ones my family comes from.
    Key to making this happen is a total commitment to what you are about to do; entering into marriage with the conviction that divorce is not an option – you would die first.
    I would think, however, that such decisive men as you are, knowing what you want, and how to get it, you will also know how to keep it. I am sure that you have decided that what you want is a lovely traditional-minded woman you can trust with your heart, soul, health, and body (and after you trust her with that, what else is left?). I would also think that you would have such trust in your judgement as to know when you have made a good choice, that finally here is someone to trust second only to yourself for a lifetime. Or do you not trust yourself to stand behind your choices? Will you become another person in a year or two and call it “growing as an individual?”
    The kind of devices the individuals in the western world prop themselves with like prenups and secret financial holdings are securities just in case their judgement failed them in this all important step. It’s a parachute just in case their dreams crash, just in case they were deceived or “they grew up in life, but their partner just stayed the same.” In short, it is protection for the individual to remain an individual apart from the marriage. This is like building a magnificent cathedral upon a foundation of corpses.
    I think you will agree that a major reason for the failing of western families is the individual ignoring the most beautiful description of marriage as “they two shall be one flesh.” One flesh meaning yes, the physical union, but more than that, how do you separate the mind from the body, the soul from the body, the body from the goods that sustain it? Impossible. If a man and his wife at marriage become one person, it is impossible then for one person to later split in two, or at whim go to make another “one flesh” with a different attractive individual.
    Do you have the will to make this kind of union? It is difficult, very difficult. It takes every ounce of concentration and strength. It makes you wake up to reality. It clarifies your mind to your own faults and energizes you to do everything in your power to better your partner in the most quiet almost unnoticeable, behind the scenes ways.
    Then say that you have done this. Say that you and your wife are of the same mind, the same heart, and needless to say are deeply in love. You are blessed with the birth of a child made by your love. While your wife is gasping from her successful labors, you order the drawing of blood from the infant in order to safegaurd yourself? Do you imagine that the pain of birth would be more to your wife than the pain of your mistrust? If you do, you will break the heart of one who treasures you above her life.
    Which can you do? Invest in your unified life, or in your double life of individuality.
    And remember how “individuality” has been used in recent years to ensnare the mind…
    And about Katia. I think all of you would agree that you would not marry such a person, that you would be much more circumspect in your choice, more prudent than to be carried away by a lovely appearance and pleasant, affectionate nature. Do not resolve to protect yourself from these false women by taking harsh measures against those good women you have and will find. Or else women such as myself who are not yet married will shrink from you and prefer to die without a truer love.

  115. socon on 10/10/2007 at 12:28 pm

    Hi Doamna,

    Thank you for your response.

    In theory, I agree with everything you are saying, however, unfortunately, the practicalities of the present age present some serious difficulties, which cannot be ignored.

    I’ll write more on this in a while on my blog…

  116. doamna on 10/11/2007 at 1:12 am

    I eagerly await learning of your thought process in this matter. Mine is based upon experience, not theory, albeit from a woman’s point of view.

  117. socon on 10/11/2007 at 2:35 pm

    To Doamna:

    1. “…considering that the theme of this site is to find a good woman and to be a good man to that woman as long as you both live. Or am I mistaken?”

    No, you aren’t mistaken.

    2. “Key to making this happen is a total commitment to what you are about to do; entering into marriage with the conviction that divorce is not an option – you would die first.”

    I agree with this.. In fact, I would extend this to say that any romantic/sexual relationship should be entered into slowly, and with a basis of mutual respect, the presumption of exclusivity, and marriage as the ideal ultimate outcome, as prerequisites. Not the disgusting “hook-up culture” we have now.

    I also agree that Marriage should be for ever, and that divorce should not be an option except under the most extreme circumstances (abuse or infidelity are the only valid ones I can think of.) This goes a long way towards creating an attitude in both partners geared towards “making the relationship work” [as opposed to just bailing out of it.]

    3. “I would also think that you would have such trust in your judgement as to know when you have made a good choice, that finally here is someone to trust second only to yourself for a lifetime.

    Ideally, yes, but unfortunately the current social climate makes this very difficult. I talked about this in my previous post. Take Katia and Andy as the case in point. Both went into the relationship with the best of intentions. This much is obvious. But it still went sour, because (post-)modern Western society is just not conducive to healthy marriages, relationships, and social life. And Men usually end up getting the short-end of the stick. (Observe the divorce laws, and the fact that 10% – 25% of Men in the West who think that they are fathers are not.) Between 67%-75% of divorces initiated in the West are “no fault divorces” initiated by women. The main reasons given by women are “I was bored”, “I grew as a person”, etc. etc. This phenomenon is increasing in major cities in the East (Russia, China, India, Korea, etc.) as well. Also, I believe that there are laws in some states in the U.S. that specify that divorced Men need to continue to pay maintenance for children that are not biologically theirs i.e. products of wife’s infidelity (!!).

    In a permissive Western Society, even a sweet, well-meaning individual like this Katia has a good chance of falling by the wayside. She said it herself… “The temptations are too much”. So, until patriarchy and conservative morality are restored (or unless we go somewhere where it still exists), Men need to protect their interests by means of pre-nups, DNA testing, etc.

    4. “Will you become another person in a year or two and call it “growing as an individual?”

    I most certainly will, but not in the way you think. We all “grow as individuals”, and this is generally a good thing. The key is to grow in a positive direction, while honouring all your previous commitments, specifically, your marital vows if you are in fact married.

    5. “The kind of devices the individuals in the western world prop themselves with like prenups and secret financial holdings are securities just in case their judgement failed them in this all important step.

    Not necessarily. See part #3 above.

    6. It’s a parachute just in case their dreams crash, just in case they were deceived or “they grew up in life, but their partner just stayed the same.”

    70% + of the time it is Men who are the victims of this.

    7. “I think you will agree that a major reason for the failing of western families is the individual ignoring the most beautiful description of marriage as “they two shall be one flesh.” One flesh meaning yes, the physical union, but more than that, how do you separate the mind from the body, the soul from the body, the body from the goods that sustain it?”

    I agree, but unfortunately our culture is toxic, and laws are becoming increasingly Draconian. Men need to protect themselves. Its just a sad reality of modern life. Which is why my personal views on the matter have been shifting for a while now in the direction of moving as far away from the Western-(Post-)modern-Urban-Liberal paradigm of life as possible. But for Men for whom this is not an attractive or viable option… these precautions are necessary.

    8. “Impossible. If a man and his wife at marriage become one person, it is impossible then for one person to later split in two, or at whim go to make another “one flesh” with a different attractive individual. Do you have the will to make this kind of union? It is difficult, very difficult. It takes every ounce of concentration and strength. It makes you wake up to reality. It clarifies your mind to your own faults and energizes you to do everything in your power to better your partner in the most quiet almost unnoticeable, behind the scenes ways. “

    I very much agree with all of this also.

    9. “Then say that you have done this. Say that you and your wife are of the same mind, the same heart, and needless to say are deeply in love. You are blessed with the birth of a child made by your love. While your wife is gasping from her successful labors, you order the drawing of blood from the infant in order to safegaurd yourself?

    Yes, this is ugly. What I think ought to happen, is this is something that should become required by Law, so that the “personal factor” is removed. It should become a norm for every birth, like compulsory HIV/STD testing has become a legal requirement before marriage. Hopefully the Men’s Movement will be able to establish this some day.

    10 ”Do you imagine that the pain of birth would be more to your wife than the pain of your mistrust? If you do, you will break the heart of one who treasures you above her life.”

    I have not yet met anyone who “treasured me above her life”. Except my mum. Maybe.

    11. “you would be much more circumspect in your choice, more prudent than to be carried away by a lovely appearance and pleasant, affectionate nature.”

    In my entire life, I have met exactly one person who fulfilled both of those characteristics. Maybe. So if I meet such a person, I probably will get “carried away”.

    12. “Do not resolve to protect yourself from these false women by taking harsh measures against those good women you have and will find. Or else women such as myself who are not yet married will shrink from you and prefer to die without a truer love”

    I have a third option. Good women such as yourself should become more in-tune with and understand the situation as it exists for Good Men in the West, and increasingly, the globe. In the past, and still, Good Men have always had to prove themselves to the women they have courted. And we have accepted this. In this day and age, is it too much to ask for women to do the same? Nothing says “I love you for you, not your money” better than a signed and sealed pre-nup.

  118. socon on 10/11/2007 at 2:39 pm

    While my long essay trails in the spam queue.. it can be viewed here:

    http://socon.wordpress.com/2007/10/11/to-doamna/

  119. socon on 10/11/2007 at 3:17 pm

    Okay, I see it’s up, so I took that post down.

  120. Doamna on 10/12/2007 at 8:31 pm

    Thank you, Socon. I very much like your style, and I appreciate the opportunity for a discussion. I find it so dishearteningly difficult to find anyone besides my husband in “real life” with whom I feel – can I say – safe – discussing an honest discontent with our society. Somehow I get the impression from most that any expression of discontent brands one as a loser, unfit to live in these “blessed” conditions. My husband would, in fact, have many things to say on this subject, but I cannot induce him to write here: he is Romanian, and as such, is culturally and historically uninterested (to put it mildly) in Russians in general. So I will muddle along in a reply.
    “Both went into the relationship with the best of intentions. But it still went sour…Western society…not conducive to healthy marriages, relationships, and social life.”
    Yes, absolutely, I agree with everything you said on point 3(and all others, except the ones I will specify), but I would like to clarify the perspective from which I spoke. Best intentions mean nothing if not backed by a strong character based upon a stronger sense of morality, ideally backed by a powerful sense of God and our responsiblity as His beings. For someone nurturing this foundation upon which all their actions are laid, it is virtually impossible to be untrue to their better half. Society can topple “Best of intentions.” It cannot topple a strong moral character. This is what I mean by “I would die first before I am unfaithful.” Call it idealism, but it takes a realist living upon his high ideals to create morals.
    You state that men need to protect themselves. I agree. May I expand upon that that humanity must protect themselves – always – against the insidious and evil…
    I find myself having to digress, thinking how very blessed I am to have been given my husband. I well know that I could have searched a lifetime for a person so good and honest and sincere and intelligent. I do genuinely empathise and pray for all I know who are searching for someone trustworthy and loving. They seem nearly extinct. And then I shudder to think the hard time of it that any future children my husband and I may have. What kind of world will it be for them? Dare I bring them into it? Even the people from my ultra-conservative Christian background are more and more infiltrated with pop culture. Sometimes I think that their brains are being substituted with bubble gum or some other useless substance! I honestly do not know the answer for someone looking for a truly good (in the real sense of the word) life. I can only believe and hope in Providence…
    It is upon Point 9 that I must linger a bit. I can see situations in which the DNA testing may be useful as mandantory, but only if the current misandric laws are still in place. My political views shy from adding new laws upon old laws dictating behavior in private life. It would, I think, be quite difficult to change the current feminist-biased laws to something more just; however, would it not be just as difficult, and more invasive to families in general to mandate DNA testing on newborns? It seems as if every new law that is passed concerning the family hinders, not helps a vibrant, independent (as a family), patriarchal life. While mandating DNA testing may initially look like a good thing, I know that I would be (as well as my husband) extremely upset if I were forced to have our child’s DNA analyzed at birth. I simply cannot trust the government with information so vital. For my way of thinking, the only option is to revoke these awful, man-enslaving laws.
    Point 10: don’t marry anyone who doesn’t, and I think all these other problems will dissolve.
    Point 11: unfortunately, yes, I think you are probably quite right. Such women do exist, I assure you, but their “price is far above rubies.” I’ve never been to Russia, but I’m sure many exist there, more likely in rural, more family-oriented areas. I think, however, that any country or area you visit that has strong moral or religious roots is likely to have such women. I think of my parents’ heritage – a Christian denomination just a few steps shy of Mennonite. The gatherings are rife with radiant, pleasing girls. The only difficulty is to win her – much the way RW man describes winning a Russian girl. Again, the seepage of pop culture is occuring at an alarming rate. But they do exist. Blog in point: biblicalwomanhoodonline.org/blog.htm. A married young woman, my age, doing everything she possibly can to make her husband happy and successful. She has many young female readers who respond positively to her worldview. While I most certainly DO NOT agree with all her opinions, I find her commitment to family and husband hopeful and refreshing. She is even pretty and intelligent. She, like most I’ve known who have this orientation, definitely is not wordly in any way, so if you are looking for someone to have all these aforementioned values whom you can also take along to clubs, I’d say you’ve got a tall order. Enough free advertising for her.
    As for point 12. I understand and to most points agree with all your reasoning, but at the same time am relieved that my husband had – and has – enough confidence in his choice of wife – me – that all our finances and investments and bills are joint and that no prenup was asked for. I don’t carry a dollar in my bag that he doesn’t know about, while he asks my advice and opinion from our largest investments down to the smallest household purchase, having the final and decisive word in EVERYTHING (mostly because he is extremely persuasive). I come from a family in which my mother bent over backward daily to honor my father and make his family look like they were the recipients of all his wealth when in reality the allowance received from him barely kept his family above poverty level. The rest of his money was his, for his double life. While I understand a man’s need to be secure, a wife must also feel secure in her husband’s esteem. I imagine that while a good woman may agree to prenups and DNA testing out of pure love, asking for these things (and again from a GOOD woman) may sow in her tender heart seeds of sadness that you do not know her as she longs to be known, and that there may possibly be corners of your heart and emotions that you reserve from her along with your worldy possessions. But then again, if you cannot do without these things and your heart is pure…God loves the pure in heart…. and surely there is someone who will love to do exactly everything that pleases you.
    Best wishes.

  121. doamna on 10/12/2007 at 11:43 pm

    I’m sorry. I forgot one thing. My husband and I were talking and he said something about this subject that I thought would apply perfectly. He was saying that a big part of marriage is intended to make a man feel not alone. That when you are in trouble, and it will happen, that there is someone dependable to turn to. For a man to never have to feel, “Gosh, I’m in such a mess now, and I can’t tell anyone and I can’t get anyone to help because they all don’t care and anyway they’ll take advantage of me when I’m down. I can’t even trust my wife…” That’s absolutely hell to feel something like that. Maybe this was part of what Katya was trying to say about explaining to your girl what you’re expecting from commitment. You should know when you marry that you will always have someone (your wife) who has your back, that there’s nothing you can’t depend on her for. Except, of course, lifting heavy things, etc… I don’t know. Maybe I’m wrong or simply can’t wrap my brain around separate finances and prenups. Maybe too much of a romantic. But I think I’d rather be a romantic and live in my idealism for awhile in bliss and take the risk that I may get cheated, than to always be holding back my trust and the total abandonment to my love. Then again, my husband would say, everyone’s life is his life, totally different and separate from anothers’. Which is another reason why I don’t think legislating DNA testing is a good idea. Family A may need it while Family B may hate it and be completely disguisted by it, but it’s still federally mandated and they feel like slaves having to submit to it.

  122. socon on 10/15/2007 at 7:33 pm

    Doamna. Fair enough :)

  123. Michael on 10/16/2007 at 7:08 am

    A word of advice for the men seeking a Russian Beauty:

    I have found after dating a dozen Russian women over the last 7 years, they are all very different from each other. You can’t stereo type them. Deal breakers are smoking, drinking to much and drugs.

    I will say all of them were very charming. Very loving and caring. Their beauty is more than skin deep. They are the most passionate lovers. All of them were intelligent, street wise and book smart. All had a good education but none ever worked in the field they were degreed in. There were no jobs for them after their education.

    Most want a partner who is their equal. EQUAL in intelligence, healthy, good looking, a good provider, stablity, etc. They want a man who will allow them their freedom and not control everything they do. Just like any American woman.

    Age is not as important when you are past your 30′s however, anything over a 10-15 year difference, you have to question motives. What is important is that you earn enough money to make them feel secure, today and in the future. That you have things in common. Sexual attraction is important as Katya said. Meeting her sexual needs in absolute must or they will find it somewhere else. Chemistry is so important.

    Most men in their 50′s are not going to keep up with a 26 year old. Only in his dreams. Be realistic. I am a very healthy 53 with 37 year old Tatiana from Siberia who is in her prime. She looks much younger than American women her age. She says I look much yonger than men in Russia my age. To her I look mid-forties. Perfect for me. What happens in 10 more years? Might need those little blue pills? We shall see. She only has to give me that “look” to put me in the mood! It took years to find her but she was worth waiting for. :-)

  124. Michael has wings on 10/17/2007 at 5:16 am

    Funny thing about age differences: My daughter is 15 years older than her fiance’s son, and her fiance’ is 15 years older than she is, her fiance is also 15 years younger than me, and my girlfriend is 15 years younger than me. Stranger things happen but I thought this was pretty rare for all of us to be 15 years apart and no one has a problem with it at all. :-)

  125. Gary (is stuck in the mud?) on 10/17/2007 at 8:44 am

    I have been ‘observing’ Russian ‘possibilities’ since my early thirties. I am now approaching fifty-one. I have never married and had virtually no relationships since my early twenties. My spiritual nature (christian — with a little ‘c’), has kept me pondering life for so long that I have allowed much of it to pass right by. This is not just related to relationships but also most other things. I did not get my first real career qualification until I was 43 so my income was marginal until then… etc. I find it almost impossible to carry through with personal communications through ‘arranged circumstances’ such as online services. I am too deeply rooted in the close, natural, personal ideas such as just meeting someone and going from there. If I go to St. Petersburg or Moscow (or some small village in the middle of nowhere) for a few weeks just for a holiday, do I stand a good chance of meeting someone, even though I do not speak Russian? Is there a way to meet good honest people who would rent a room or… a couch… to a guy around fifty who just wants to visit, get to know some locals, make some friends (who aren’t $dollarized$ like N.A.’s) and maybe… meet a nice woman 20-30-40-something? It wouldn’t hurt if she were spiritual… even christian (and not very religious). Or would you still recommend using bonifide services to weed out the ‘cons’?

  126. Gary (is stuck in the mud?) on 10/17/2007 at 9:41 am

    Wow! After reading about one fourth I left the above; then tried to get through most of the rest. Wow! Some real emotions here… and I was just wondering… have many of you considered that your failed relationships are not necessarily ‘all the other persons’ fault’. I hear a lot of socio-this and economic-that and very little about the true nature of all mankind where stable relationships exist… thanking god and giving him credit for the good lives we enjoy is the very foundation of the North American dream, both Canadian and US. This ‘spoiled attitude’ you refer to does not exist only among the woman. Most N.A. men are so focused on worldly, physical and financial pleasures and values that it is no wonder their woman screw around on them… they are constantly screwing around on god. I speak, and am hopefully heard, totally real and without religion. I firmly believe that the single most simply and profound problem to be addressed is how ‘man’, whether male or female, likes to get together in a group in order to decide what is right or wrong, instead of getting together to discover what is right.

  127. Ceiver on 10/17/2007 at 11:47 am

    Gary (is stuck in the mud?)

    When someone is stuck in the mud (or the gutter), I prefer to give a hand and help him/her get out of it. I avoid at all cost allowing he/she to pull me down to it. So get out of the mud, you deserve better. Feel it.
    I agree a lot of N.A. men are focused on getting ahead, and as a result, neglect their families. I don’t think it’s intentional, everyone needs their own space at times, but balance is necessary.
    I’ve notice a lot of Russian women are looking for guys that will put their families first. Seems we should be doing this all along, and there will still be time to play golf and drink beer with the guys.

    ok, you’re 51, you are still young, 50+ years left if you take care of yourself physically and mentally. Get in shape, eat right. Take a chance and visit Russia (not Moscow or St Petersburg… too expensive) or Ukraine. Go for it.

    Life is for living and living is nicer with a good woman.

  128. wonderlander on 10/23/2007 at 10:58 pm

    All Hails!

    Haven’t been around long… and now the site doesn’t recognize me! 8-o

    Gonzo: (Upon appreciation of the joke)

    Ouch. Not at all self-centered, and so very thoughtful of the woman, to value her butt not her mind, talent, aspirations. Probably in order to prevent her “growth as a person” which might lead to divorce… yet, Gentlemen, in a poll among all Russian wives who ever got stolen for a night or for a lifetime, most will tell, “That man’s attitude was different from my husband’s: he was interested in my personality.” The rest would be the butts enchanted by another “magic wand”.

    BTW, has anyone looked for statistics how many Russian divorces are initiated by women and how many adulteries occur on both sides?

    Socon: now to broken homes in the FSU.

    Abusive parents put mines into children’s psyche. So do families conserved despite of scandals and alienness. In such circumstances, a girl can possibly get troubled: choose wrong men or get them twisted to her worst expectations, or just turn cold and clueless at times. As for incomplete families, the outcomes can be more or less optimistic (especially when the remaining parent hasn’t fed the kid with horror stories on “that scoundrel”). I call it “Clear Canvas Background”, free of destructive patterns which one might inherit from an imperfect family. In the best case, she can draw a wholesome life on this canvas. In the worst case, you face someone ignorant of how to build close relationships, – which you are able to repair, with enough will, emotional competence, and forgiveness.

    A side comment… Many Russians dislike the States particularly for its model of “police state” which would soon DNA-test citizens to prove they are themselves, for their own security. Intense suspicion, regulation and hedging are likely to bring much cultural shock in a relationship with a Russian woman who might [otherwise] “treasure you above her own life”.

    Gary:

    Traveling here (be that city or wilderness) off-the-cuff is dangerous in the XXI. Better is to have someone waiting for you with hospitality. In your shoes, I would probably try to ICQ for Russians or Ukrainians with kin interests, of a generation over 35-40, men or women; declare having nothing to be taken advantage of; and see if sincere talk develops further. What would be more difficult is finding promising opportunities as you arrive. Nothing plausible occurs other than museums and classical concerts.

    Best regards,
    Comrade Natalia.

  129. Craig on 10/24/2007 at 3:27 am

    Natalia,

    Who told you that the States will “soon DNA-test citizens to prove they are themselves, for their own security” ? Pravda?? I think you are predisposed to think these kinds of things about America. I would suggest that you need much more real-world experience before making statements of this kind. They are especially ironic coming from a resident of the former Soviet Union. You should know better what totalitarianism is and isn’t.

  130. socon on 10/24/2007 at 5:50 pm

    I’m not even from the States.

    I never said that “the States will soon DNA-test citizens to prove they are themselves, for their own security”

    I said that they, and every other country that has dispensed with patriarchy and traditional morality ought to, in order to level the playing field for men.

  131. Craig on 10/24/2007 at 6:35 pm

    socon – Natalia said that. My comment was to her.

  132. socon on 10/24/2007 at 7:42 pm

    craig – I know. I was the one who started the DNA thing, so I was clarifying my position.

    My comment was to everyone. :)

  133. Ceiver on 10/24/2007 at 7:54 pm

    I hate the Maury Povitch tv show “who’s your daddy?”

    Then there was the story of a girl who had s*x with two guys on the same day. After the baby was born, she called for DNA test. The test proved positive to both men.
    they were twins.

  134. socon on 10/24/2007 at 8:22 pm

    Ceiver…

    Many years ago I read in that rag People (…don’t ask my why I was reading that rag, I was like 12 years old…) about a British woman who did that with three guys on the same night, and had triplets, each with a different father…

    Is there a “puke” emoticon I can put here?

  135. wonderlander on 11/01/2007 at 4:25 pm

    Gentlemen, I offer my apology for a tactless joke.

    We are used to projecting far-reaching conclusions in an attempt to forewarn totalitarian trends too memorable yet, and to have another obscure laugh. I wish you could read Russian Orwellesque feuilletons. But of course throwing pins over the fence is unappropriate. (BASHED SMILEY)

    God save Ukraine, an islet of freedom. )

    Sincerely, Comrade Natalia.

  136. wonderlander on 11/01/2007 at 10:44 pm

    Oops, I meant BASHFUL / BLUSHED for those pins. )))) Just looked up the dictionary. )

  137. socon on 11/20/2007 at 5:30 pm

    A must read…

    The Garbage Generation

  138. Thomas on 04/19/2008 at 6:33 pm

    Most probably, just another victim… Check out the link below…

    http://www.geocities.com/wwu777us/Opportunistic_Russian_Women.htm

  139. Jealous on 10/14/2008 at 7:45 am

    A friend of mine married a 19 year old dark haired Russian beauty when he was 47. She became pregnant almost right away. They now have a son and she’s very pregnant with another. I didn’t think their marriage would last because of the age difference but they seem very happy together. I have to admit I’m a little jealous. With the tensions between Russia and America now, would a trip like his even still be possible?

    • Stuart on 03/14/2011 at 3:35 am

      The trip would be possible, but if you’re anything like me, marriage not! I’m 47 too.

  140. Kisha on 10/14/2008 at 10:02 am

    God, this friend of yours is so determined to breed children with down syndrom or any other hereditary deseases?

  141. doamna on 10/14/2008 at 1:24 pm

    Kisha,
    The likelihood of the birth of a child with Down’s Syndrome increases with the age of the mother, not the father. My mother’s last child was born with Down’s Syndrome. She is such a joy – an innocent, loving little girl that I cannot imagine life without. Until you know one of these special people, don’t start pitying those who live with them.

  142. Kisha on 10/14/2008 at 4:34 pm

    Father’s age as well, Doamna and recent studies prove it…
    As everything in this world sperm “goes off” with age; in other words increased paternal age may lead to an increased frequency of chromosome abnormalities.
    I’m not pityfing families of children with down syndrome, it was their choice wasn’t it? What I’m saying is that older paternal age may result in different deseases in children.

  143. Richard on 10/14/2008 at 5:42 pm

    Kisha,
    Sorry to disagree but nearly every medical study and survey of the past two decades has eliminated the father’s age as a contributing factor in Downs Syndrome. What’s more, the mother’s age is still more suspect than proven as a primary factor. Statistically, there are a higher percentage of DS babies born to couples in their prime than to couples where one or both parents are older. Until a direct connection can be made based on actual numbers all of our banter here can be considered little more than rumor and gossip.
    There are so many women today who have so many different high risk pregnancies because of smoking, drinking, “casual” drug use, an array of partners with unknown genetic factors, etc. that nailing down any of the more common birth defects is only getting harder to do.
    Something else to consider in the reliability of any medical research is this; who pays for the study often determines the outcome. As we have seen for nearly 40 years, a premise is studied and the results bear out the hypothesis. Then someone with an opposing viewpoint comes along and disproves the basic theory, then later still an independent study takes place which comes up with an entirely different set of results than either of the previous findings.
    If you have even the most basic background in science you know that once a base line is established, no amount of testing and retesting can change the facts. Something either “is or it isn’t” as my science profs used to say. The only way to change the results is to add, eliminate or make errors to the process, thus nullifying the test.
    By the way, one recent “study” suggested that people involved in medical study groups are “little more than 50% reliable when disclosing medical history and other conditions possibly affecting the results”.

  144. Kisha on 10/28/2008 at 7:21 pm

    Richard, I’m not going to argue with you about human genom as it is not the most throughly studied thing in this world. Cant see what is wrong though with pointing out that paterntal age (quite old in this case) can result is some serious deseases in babies(as well the mothers age and the state of health). And you don’t have to be a PhD to say that, its just commom sense.

  145. Stuart on 03/14/2011 at 1:49 am

    Well what you’ve seen isn’t what I’ve seen! And what I’ve seen isn’t what you’ve seen. It’s nice to read on the computer and build up one’s hopes, though, all you middle-aged men. But don’t come to Russia and expect to marry a young woman, because it’s an impossible dream. Especially if you’re a western man, like me! Russian women prefer their own types.

    • rw_man on 03/14/2011 at 8:39 am

      Stuart..

      I and many other Men out there are living proof that you are wrong.

      Russian Women are not particularly attracted to pessimism in any Man and I believe you have shown a great deal of this.

      Keep in mind that there are many Russian Men who also have a hard time establishing a relationship with Russian Women.

      This is certainly not due to any lack of available ladies I assure you..

      Quit the contrary it is often an issue with a lack of viability in the man as a qualified mate.. or in many cases some type of social/cultural ineptitude or personality dysfunction.

      I would suggest that the more you try to grossly over generalize “the impossibility” of Western Men finding their lovely 2nd half for themselves the more difficult you will make this quest for yourself.

      The stance of this very website is the bi-polar opposite of your position. This is simply because I readily knew that it would be much easier for me to find my own happiness if I did whatever I could to help other Men and Women do the same.

      And you know what Stuart?.. It worked very very well.

      May I humbly suggest that you go out and get some serious attitude adjustment.

      • Stuart on 03/16/2011 at 2:09 am

        Sir, thank you for your reply. I do hope you don’t get the wrong impression by my comments. I don’t wish to sound pessimistic or to put people off trying. My attitude is really quite similar to many average middle-aged men from my neck of the woods. I agree that the stance of this website is opposite to my experiences here, but it shouldn’t stop me from telling about what I have experienced here. I think readers should be aware of the possible consequences of spending lots of time and money and hope by coming to Russia only to find an empty pot of gold!

    • sam r ogilvie on 03/14/2011 at 8:11 pm

      Hello Stuart,

      I am well aware of the time constraints we all face, but could you possibly elaborate on your experience? It would be interesting to know where you are meeting women, how you get to know them or try to get to know them, what type of woman you approach and are interested in, and if they have directly expressed a prejudice against or dislike of foreign men in general, just you personally or is that something you have concluded via observation. You said that most women you have encountered are focused on building a career and financial wealth. Does that include women in the less remunerative helping professions like medicine, etc.?

      • Stuart on 03/16/2011 at 2:32 am

        Hello Sam,
        I shall try to answer as briefly and accurately as possible.
        Most women I try to meet are from contacts of people I already know. Most are in their thirties or forties, and come from various backgrounds. None have told me they don’t like foreign men or their attitudes, but it has become quite clear to me that 70 years of communism and isolation from the outside world has affected their view of foreigners. Our traditions of such examples as responsibility with spending, getting things done right, outspokenness in public mixed with a stiff upper lip , our ‘strange’ sense of humour, leave them quite perplexed, at times. Their reaction is often fear or suspicion, unfortunately. If I were to suddenly become the sort of man they expect me to be, it would mean a complete change of character and that’s not who I am, or indeed who I would want to be. Those women who are focussed on a career are generally more educated or intelligent than the others, who if they have less well-paid jobs, speak very little English if at all. I hope I have been of some help to you. Please don’t think of me as unkind or pessimistic, as I just try to be as accurate as possible when asked questions. Best wishes, Stuart.

        • sam r ogilvie on 03/16/2011 at 6:34 am

          Stuart,

          Thanks for your quick and informative response. I am interested in your experience and perspective and the truth as you see it. So, as one searching for answers, you owe me no apologies. I am very appreciative of your accuracy and honesty.

          Because of my views or perspective, perhaps I am viewed as a pessimist myself. Individually, I think people have changed little over the eons. For every friendly, helpful person, there’s a handful of jerks. That nature must be influenced by genetics primarily, because the differences between siblings reared in the same household are nothing short of remarkable. I try to keep that in mind when I deal with individuals of other nationalities, regions, or races, because I am prone to generalize and attribute individual peculiarities to cultural influences. I don’t think that is the case with you. I am confident that you have given an accurate appraisal of your considerable experience, and that is good for all of us.

        • sam r ogilvie on 03/16/2011 at 5:47 pm

          Stuart,

          Though no fan of social network websites, I am laboring on at Vkontakte, or VK, in an attempt to learn more about the people of Russia and its former republics from afar. As I have said there, if I make a few good friends along the way, that would be great, too.

          By and large my experience has been a positive one. I have met several very fine people, though some of them are mere children. A half dozen or so will probably remain friends for life, and I am really pleased with that.

          I have been confused many times, offended many times and encouraged many times by things people have written and things people have done. The thing that perplexes me most is the fact that a significant number of the people that accept friend requests or request that I add them as friends never respond to simple questions. Some respond to inquiries or greetings by “unfriending” me or erasing simple inquiries I make on their walls. Yesterday, after failing to get a response for several days from a woman living in Moscow, I sent another message and asked if I had offended her, etc. I should add that I had exchanged messages with her before, that we have a mutual friend who now lives in Cairo, that she hopes to move permanently to New York(a city where she apparently does business) and that she spends a great deal of time at the site(literally hours per day). Here is her unedited response: “I have read, but was busy sometimes I do not answer do not worry All people are different now I have no mood.” Thankfully, many of my “friends” have been courteous enough to reply and politely say that they were very busy, but would get back to me later. I guess I could say that at least this woman did respond and was honest. But the fact of the matter is that according to normal and accepted standards of etiquette in the Southeastern United States, such a reply is unacceptable. Children raised in good families in this region are taught that they are to be courteous and friendly to others regardless of how busy they are or how they feel or what mood they are in. In the thousands of letters I have exchanged with people in Russia and its former republics, I have seen similar responses many times before; enough to know that it is not rare, and is possibly socially acceptable there. So, to make a long story short, I can understand your experience, Stuart, and find it believable. The major difference I see between women in the United States and Russia is that Russian women do seem to value marriage and family more than American women do at this point in time. I think it is fair to say that more Russian women would abandon successful careers to establish a family and a good marriage. They definitely have traditional views of the man’s role in a relationship. Part of that is that the man is to carry the entire financial load. In contrast, most American women express a desire to form partnerships with their husbands in all respects, including financial ones. Like you, I am speaking strictly from my own experience. I imagine thousands of men and women from any number of countries would disagree completely with what I have said, and say that my experience is limited and not representative. I will not argue with that. All I can say is that is my honest appraisal.

  146. Stuart on 03/14/2011 at 3:32 am

    I wish I were wrong!!

    • Richard on 03/14/2011 at 11:17 am

      Stuart,

      It would be great if the whole world understood relationships as well as I do. We could forget about all sorts of silly factors in creating happiness. There would be such a loss of work for divorce lawyers as to burden the Earth’s surface with staggering unemployment.

      HOWEVER, as I’m sure you’ve guessed, the world isn’t going to stop all of their silly game playing and drivel quite yet just because I would like to see it happen.

      Fortunately for us all, the same applies to your life experience.

      I’m old enough and have been around enough to admit that what fails to work well in my life doesn’t necessarily fail to work well in everyone else’s life.

      You are 47, single and living in a different country than the one you were raised in. You have lived there for a few years and so far you have not felt that the local women are receptive to your type of male persona. Okay, fine. So for over 40 years of your life the world of dating and relationships has left you in the same position as hundreds of thousands of other men but the conclusions you’ve made in just 3 or 4 years seem to be cut in stone. That’s just fine, too: for you. But that doesn’t mean that some other whole idea is flawed; and I appreciate that you have a couple of times made it clear that this is your opinion only, not pure fact.

      So if you are of an opposing mind set based on your experience, then why do you feel the need to try to dissuade others from seeking their happiness in the FSU?

      How about we do some simple math on the subject to try finding perspective, and these are only hypothetical cases.

      We’ll say that 100 North American men travel to the FSU intending to find romance. As with most studies we must consider a few things such as 80/20, 50/50, and -10. The 80/20 rule says that 80% of the effort comes from 20% of the participants. The 50/50 rule says that in unknown situations, only about half of the participants take the situation seriously. And finally the -10 rule which says to automatically drop 10% from your totals for random error.

      It would be foolish to try pulling all of these factors into a single result but taking just the first (and most accepted) of them, the one that says 80% of the effort is derived from 20% of the participants; this would tell us that 20 of those 100 men are going to give it their best shot.

      These 20 guys will spend more, search harder, stay longer or do whatever else it takes to try to make something good happen. They will probably go further out of their way to meet people that have no direct input in the end result but might help with familiarity of the region, offer additional contacts and suggestions, etc. They will be the ones with the best chance for success simply because they are willing to put out the effort required to get the best results. With all that, let’s say half of them still end up going home with no real prospects; that would still leave 10. Those remaining 10 end up with the foundation for romance and maybe even a lasting marriage and family. Ten of our fictitious 100 men have gone to Russia and come home successful.

      I submit to you that they have beaten the odds of having the same success at home by a multiple of at least 10. Where I would accept the 10% success rate of those men who have traveled half way around the world, I will also say that the same effort would yield about a 1% chance for success back at home in North America, and that’s just to reach the point of finding a quality marriage prospect. It doesn’t take into consideration that you have to look at the next decade or two for the odds of longevity, which we already know is less than 50% in the first 5 years here at home.

      Beside that, the majority of those 100 men would come home with some positive life experience that they never could have acquired in NA. That is a benefit to even the ones that never found romance.

      Casinos are gambling. Lotteries are gambling. Prospecting for gold in Alaska or The Northwest Territories is not; it’s a calculated risk with a reasonable possibility of reward. Traveling to another country with the intent of establishing yourself and possibly finding a lasting personal relationship is a safer and more hopeful risk than prospecting for gold.

      We weigh our opportunities in life against the chance of failure. That’s our nature. Some of those opportunities are no-brainers and some require a great deal of thought and planning. As is generally the case, the “lucky ones” are those who have done the careful planning and the hard work required of us all should we expect to succeed.

      If you are personally finding it hard to meet local women in the area where you now live (and assuming that you want to do that) I suggest trying harder to be attentive to the needs and desires of those locals and carry a more positive outlook as you do. When you have something good to offer, people want to know how to get it. Offer something better and more will want to get it.

  147. Andy on 01/10/2012 at 1:08 pm

    Perhaps it’s me, I’m not sure, but I found that this article is very ageist & very sexist, if I were capable of holding down a relationship, age wouldn’t be an issue, I don’t mind being with an older lady or one of my age group, I can’t have children so looking for a younger lady who wants a family would be a waste of time as it just wouldn’t work, on a shallow level, there are some very beautiful Russian & Ukrainian ladies in their 40′s, 50′s & 60′s, but not just going on appearances, surely, relationships are based on more than just looks? I know that I have never been successful in relationships, but I would have thought that the personality makes the person & that the looks are an added bonus…….perhaps that’s why I’m still single at 45

  148. Richard on 01/10/2012 at 1:39 pm

    Andy,

    I’m sure that you can tell from the way rw_man writes and from most of the people responding on this site, that the beauty of women in the FSU is just as you’ve said; a bonus. The character and personality traits which these women seem to share is clearly the key to why men should seek them out. Traditional values, personal habits and innate charm are among the reasons to consider a relationship with someone from this part of the world.

    While your personal experiences have had disappointing results, you seem to have come through it all without a lot of bitterness. The fact that you won’t be fathering any children gives you an advantage as far as being with women around your own age, no matter where they hail from.

    The majority of people who follow this site are supportive of the character and dignity of Russian and other FSU women. It is evident that the available choices here in North America leave a great deal to be desired.

    Best of luck to you in whatever the future holds.

  149. Kisha on 01/12/2012 at 12:19 am

    I was thinking about this “older men younger women” phenomen foreingers usually resort to when looking for a much younger woman.
    I honestly think it’s more of an American thing than Russian, there’s no tradition here for young girls to go out with old men. Such men are commonly reffered as “old goat” and not encouraged/supported by the public.

    I was trying to think of examples of such age difference based on people I know where a husband/bf would be older (by older I mean 10-15 years gap which presented as common). The examples turned to be just a few.

    1) my parents’ friend who ended up leaving his nagging and obese bad tempered wife and getting on with her fitness instructor friend who’s 12 years younger. That happened when he was 52.
    2) one of my cousin’s family friends the husband is 15 years older than the wife and they got married in his 50s.
    3) the last example is my brother’s friend who only dates women in their 20s.
    He’s well past 20 himself, round 36 if I’m correct. It is not that he refuses to date older women, it’s actually the fact that he is not successful with them, as he stoped developing mentally at the age of 20. So most older (and quite often better looking women) found him too immature to deal with.
    And realistically speaking for the most people here huge age difference in a couple is a sign of immaturity and fear of commitment in the older part. Applies to women as well.
    Most Russian men become ready for marriage by the age of 27-30, for some it happens even earlier. That leaves the only one appeal to the older men – money and status it brings. Which explains all sorts of wealthy/famous people on TV and in business marrying someone 15 years younger every 5 years. This does not happen with overwhelming majority of Russian population.
    Just my personal experience of 30 years spent in the country called Russia.

    • Andy G on 01/12/2012 at 12:52 am

      That’s a very interesting point from someone who sees for themselves first hand, I have tried dating agencies which I have found to be a way of extortion, all the agencies I have looked at all state that women prefer men 10 to 15 years older, to me, I also think that it seems to be a sign of immaturity & fear of commitment.

      I have been told that I have a fear of commitment as I have stated that I can’t father children. I noticed that most ladies from the FSU would like to have children, they want a family, many women from all over the world want children & families so that isn’t just down to FSU ladies.

      Thanks for passing on your views Kisha

  150. Bill on 12/04/2012 at 2:40 pm

    I read many of your posting,from both sides of the fense,woman and men,now my problem. Why would I want to marry a younger Russian Lady,by the way I am 60. My biggest reason,I got really lucky Gram gave me some great genes,so I look 40, I love children having spent 20 years raising my Boys as a single parent and a very active person,in Scouting ,Little league,problem my boys grew up to be great young men,so I would want to meet a Lady with a child young enough to do things,camp,travel together as a family,so the child would or I say should be 10 or younger. And Russian moms are great with their children ,their culture values education,see my friend married a girl from Kiev years ago,well 16 because they have two young ladies that are wonderful,Zhanna taught them to grow up to be very cultural and as far as a Russian woman feeling lost here is not true,they will meet other Russians,all it takes is meeting one and this will lead to meeting many others,be ready to learn their culture,because they will get together and still celabrate, sing and share,so you should plan on becoming part of this,and for you thinking this 60 year old is bragging,please,I have dated a 38 year old with 4 Lovely kids,me and the kids had a blast,sorry Mom just couldn`t keep up, Americans lazy. oh and if you can find a 60 yr. old 5`9 165lbs with long brown hair riding Harleys,say Hi,I am a friendly guy. So now on to my guest,ya I know why did I wait so long, well lost a 22yr old Son in the gulf,he was a Sgt.,that can take some getting over. now I realize,life ;live it like today is your last day on earth,make people happy,and go for it

    • Lisa on 12/05/2012 at 9:33 am

      god bless you and i hope you will be successfull in your search. however i would recomend not to marry a woman whos child`s father is present in the childs life. otherwise he just wont let his son or dauther move to usa and that is quite understandable.

      there are, however, many decent women in russia and fsu, 30 – 50 years old, with grown up kids or kids who dont have dads. a relationship with a kid can be a bit complicated so search carefully. see how shes acting around her friends and family before making the decision. try to find a cheerfull, enthusiastic but respectfull woman. i hope you will find what you want and wish you all the best.

  151. Fuzzbuster on 08/16/2013 at 2:20 pm

    The author of this article is absolutely correct in his observations about the value of women to men as they age. Not just Russian women, but all young (and older) women. Its just that Russian women are tuned into this and American women have been fed a bunch of crap by the feminist culture. Feminists can say and do what they want, but what they do and say has absolutely no bearing on how men perceive women as they age. Nor does it affect a boy/man’s maturity level and capability of caring for a family as he ages. Thee are two things at work here: (1) On average girls become women at around age 16. They continue to mentally mature over the next few years, but physically, they are complete women. (2) We all know that boys do not physically mature until around age 20; but mentally, it will take about another 10 years until after they have physically matured until they are truly ready to commit to the responsibilities of being with one woman and raising a family. Anyway, I have a little girl, and before she reaches the age of 16, I plan on having a discussion with her to encourage her to actively look for men 5-8 years older than her, starting around age 21.

  152. joe doherty on 11/16/2013 at 6:17 pm

    Hi Just want to say I’m fifty six but keep in great shape. always looked at least ten years younger. Met a beautiful Russian girl she’s twenty eight. Had no idea about the age differences until I started reading about Dating Russian girls. Anyway-she is everything I’ve read about and a million times more. And I think who in their right mind would ever let a girl like this go? I chatted with several before deciding on her but was amazed how-in America you might wait a lifetime to find one woman that is amazing-tender-caring. And not find that again. In Russia it seems they are on every street-everywhere. All with deep hearts-and I could go on and on. While in America Many of the women-not all but many it’s about gimmie-gimmie and maybe you can be on my friends list-now go away. There is not a lot to draw a man into that type of woman. The Russian Woman seems the ideal partner.The one I am talking with is comming to my visit soon. And I can’t wait. I’m sold-hats off to Russian women-they are the best!!

  153. JJ Messen on 05/30/2014 at 11:35 pm

    I’m currently communicating with a beautiful Russian woman 23 years younger than I, after meeting her through “Elena’s Models.” Her photos and letters don’t show up on any Google searches, so I am fairly certain she isn’t a scammer (If she starts asking money, I will not trust her anymore).

    I’m not unusually handsome or anything, but I do look young… and have attracted some younger women here in the US.

    She and I have engaged in long discussions about our age difference. She pretty much presented the same opinions that this editorial did… that 1, the older man younger woman motif is not rare in Russia. 2, Young Russian women are attracted to fidelity, security, and maturity.

    This is opposed to western women, who through the process of feminism, have become “more like men.” Adopting male like attitudes, young western women care less about character and more about sexual thrills… six pack abs and bad boy personalities. Divorced middle aged western women may shift their focus to a man’s financial prowess… after all, they have debts accumulated by children in college, etc, etc.

    On the topic of a woman’s education, it is against a man’s nature to be with a woman who feels intellectually superior to him. One of my much younger American girlfriends started mocking some of my opinions and beliefs, since each younger generation feels more “enlightened” than the fuddy duddys that came before. I watched the initial respect she showed me fade away, as soon as she knew I had an emotional attachment to her. Her pretense of respect was no longer needed.

    Western women have an ingrained resentment of men. How many of us guys have heard the sentence, “If women ruled the world, there would be no wars?” Even the idea that some middle aged men would seek out a younger and supportive Russian bride irks the hell out of most western women. “How dare they!! Middle aged farts, where’s your six pack abs?” Notice they don’t care whether the man has good character… and there’s the whole issue. Do foreign women value a man’s character more than western women?

    Men desire a woman who need, respect, and support their husband. We don’t need a wife who competes with us, or demeans us. Absorb most situation comedies and commercials on western television. Men are dim witted cavemen, while women are the enlightened bringers of wisdom. Men are generally depicted as Homer Simpson.

    Of course, I’m concerned about marrying a young Russian woman, only to see her meet a younger American stud and run off with him. But I cannot marry a divorced woman with emotional baggage. I have never married, nor have children… and don’t savor the idea of hearing a child say “You can’t tell me what to do!! You’re not my Father!!”

  154. Drew Malone Raines III on 08/23/2014 at 7:00 pm

    lots of information to adjust to, THANK YOU JJ, as I am a retired USMarine and have traveled to UKRAINE 3 times for 90 day visits, mostly enjoying taking pictures of my EUROPEAN Ancestry, as I am an American Indian Ancestry. At 66, i am in great physical shape, and look about 50-55 depending on who one talks with, bottom line, I
    have a desire to “meet up” so to speack with a Russian/Ukraine Lady for marriage – (Family history – ancestors die between 98-105 and the last ancestor to live without war/ car wrecks was my great grandfather who was shot off a horse at 98yr. trying to stop a bank robbery. NOW With that said, WOMEN AROUND THE WORLD will take an older man for husband however the RUSSIAN Women are far the most faithful IF they are treated with respect and love — me, i’m for moving OUT of the USA and into RUSSIA or UKRAINE – they really have more FREEDOM than we do, but men lack the desire to work and strive to have more and YES beatiful women everyone – the lure to Russian/Ukraine Men to be unfaithful is daily and they pursue it, American, Canadian, British & Australian men (OLDER) can and do walk from this, and when WE date attractive women and they stray, I walk away, as they are not the true moral Russian/Ukraine woman seeking a soul mate, they are seeking a way out with the best that is able to take them. JUST MY 2 cents…. Gentlemen, Ladies, bottom line, BE HAPPY, be safe, Be honest, BE TRUE, and YOU can live anywhere… as for the queer… thank god for PUTIN and Ukraine – 87% of the people in these nations are MORAL and believe in NATURE’s LAW… I’d help buy the island nation for all of you to live on, and any who like the life style… just stay out of my circle of living.. Semper FI
    PS: Obtaining the RUSSIAN VISA INVITE is the hardest thing to overcome. (or you can’t expect to stay more than 2 weeks)… been there done that, and having trouble … but I shall overcome..

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