A very thoughtful reader has introduced me to a great video clip from a romantic European film called Les Poupées russes (The Russian Dolls) .
Now if you’ve never been to Russia or the FSU..
And you’ve never had the chance to actually MEET a traditional Russian beauty face to face..
Then watching this clip may be the closest experience you’ll have to understanding what it’s like.
Because I can certainly remember when it happened to me.
And just like the “poor guy” in this video who has a classic deer in the headlight moment before he gets SMACKED by “Natasha”..
I ain’t never been the same since.
And neither would you.
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Les poupées russes is one of my most favorite movies of all time (along with its prequel, L’auberge espagnol). And Natasha is an actual ballerina, I believe she’s now a soloist with the Mariinsky. Her name is Evgenia Obraztsova, and she’s absolutely divine !
The clip is nice, but could you please not say, “if you’ve never been to Russia or the FSU” on a site about Russian women? I’m from the FSU and it’s quite annoying how everyone just assumes that means I’m from Russia and/or that I’m Russian.
I know that what you meant by that sentence is the fact that there are sizable Russian populations in every FSU country, especially in Kazakhstan and Ukraine, but if a foreigner were to read that it would add to that misconception that all the FSU countries (Ukraine, Georgia, Uzbekistan, Armenia, etc..) are just “Russia” and their people “Russians.” Besides, FSU women are very diverse, and a Caucasian or Central Asian woman does not have the same way of thinking and culture as a Slavic one, so you can’t approach them the same way as you can a Russian or Ukrainian.
Also, the title of your youtube video says “Nasha”, which in Russian means “our”- not sure if this is a typo, just wanted to let you know.
Hi ABC123 thanks for the heads up.
Check out my FAQ section and read number 6.
6. What about women from other Former Soviet Union (FSU) countries such as the Ukraine, Belarus, or Kazakhstan?
Although it would be more accurate to call this “FSU Women – The Real Truth most” many American men would not know what this means and it would not be practical to label this site this way. Although there are many FSU countries the women from these areas more or less share the same overall characteristics and values that are described in this site.
That makes sense, thank you for the reply. A lot of those other questions in the FAQ apply nearly word-for-word for other FSU countries.
Have you been anywhere else in the FSU other than Russia?
I watched this movie. It is not mainly about the Natasha and the guy she falls in love with. Looking at this movie I see it shows problems and what is wrong in our society. I don’t hate the movie at all but immorality, selflisness, etc are in it. The only women who are not selfcenter or bad is Natasha, and her British husband’s sister Wendy. That is just one example in the movie.
Funny, I have this movie added to my netflix queue. It’s available for streaming. I watch it today.
=D This is similar to how my husband was when we met the first time!!! He told me that after our first meeting he called his friends to tell about me – he was completely bewitched. And it is so funny how his family reacts when they see me.
Haha that’s cute. You unusually attractive people live in an interesting world. I don’t have a membership to that club…but I have the tee shirt!! Being at least average myself (on a good day) I wonder what your world must be like. (The average guy quietly pouts)
How long did you guys date? How long married? Any advice, suggestions names and numbers of your eligible sisters?
I hope this doesn’t get translated to be rude. I’m just joking.
Really, I would like to know what allowed you to single out your husband. What do you feel women as yourself find most attractive in men in general? In “Western” men?
Thanks for any input!
Ken,
Attractive people live in the same world as the rest of the universe. All of us have similar fears, insecurities and desire for being happy and healthy. If person thinks that she/he is entitled to better treatment, more money, better life without any work on their part, simply due to the fact that they are unusually attractive – this person is greatly misguided and they pay a price for that.
As for what attracts me in a man (including western men): in the long list of his traits it’s his ability to see me whole : appearance, character and soul. I need him to love not only how I look, but also what I’m on the inside. My beauty will fade some day (lets hope not in the next 3 decades), but my soul will stay the same. I have many dates going nowhere when guys can’t get over physical appearance and start learning about me as a whole person, which limit future relationship for me. I guess it’s a balance of both: man should be attracted to girls looks, but be smart enough to pass them in order to see her soul.
Still looking for my one and only,
Evushka
I had never had men around me who would put physical appearance on the first place. They just don’t get attracted to me. Why? I guess because they can sense that in this case they are wasting their time with me.
I see in people their souls and I always talk to their hearts. And men can see that right away. And they appreciate that.
I remember one guy told me that he had many women but there was no one to talk heart to heart. And he didn’t want to pursue my body. He said honestly “I just want to talk to you. I know with you I can talk sincerely – and that is what I need.”
Evsuhka, my question to you: “what do you see in men? Pure souls or guys who want just sex?”
Katen’ka,
Reply to your question is in my previous post. I look for a balance. Sex without heart to heart relationship is meaningless, but just talks and no physical contact wouldn’t do in a happy marriage. Physical and intellectual stimulation plus deep feelings for each other – that what I’m looking for. Younger guys in their twenties (in my mind they are not men yet) by nature can’t concentrate on anything else but physical appearance of the date. There is exceptions of course, I just haven’t met them. That’s why I prefer to date men at least older then 35 so I don’t waist my time. From my experience we have a lot in common, have a lot to talk about, they know about chivalry, we have same maturity level. This list can go on and on.
Anyway, thank you for sharing you story, it’s a great to learn about successful happy marriage between Russian and American. Gives me hope. Wish you both all the best!
Evushka
My husband is not American. He is from Chile!!! =) We are happy together not because of pure luck, we work a lot on ourselves and our relationships.
Evsuhka , I understand what you mean – consciously you look for balance. But in our subconscious mind there can be difference beliefs.
For example, when I began living with my husband, I learned about myself – that is my set of expectations (negative) I was not even aware of. My husband would tell me – “you know, I am not like that. Why do you think I can do that?” I would tell him “I don’t know. That is what I saw in my family.” or “That is what I always hear from women.” And we worked on this things, so I could think and expect something different (positive) and we can enjoy our life.
And there is a number of beliefs deep in my mind that I am not still aware of. These things attract certain people and situations to me, even if I don’t want them. When it happen I approach myself with a simple question “how do I attract this situation? What should I change?” Then I change it within me and I have the results I want.
Actually, this is very good thing to do, if one wants fruitful lasting relationship with a partner.
Hello Evushka,
Your comment:
“If person thinks that she/he is entitled to better treatment, more money, better life without any work on their part, simply due to the fact that they are unusually attractive – this person is greatly misguided and they pay a price for that”.
This is so common in any society I suppose. I certainly can’t blame someone for using what God has given them to find a “Better” mate, but you are so right that misusing or abusing that “Power” will cost them later in life. If a beautiful lady uses her gift of attractiveness AND has character, morality and femininity (which take work)- she will have better choices in men, if SHE knows what to look for. I’m hopeful that you decent (Spectacular by N/A standards) ladies study the “Personality Styles” discussed on other threads (On this site) as a way of avoiding mistakes in your men.
Here is a link that will be very interesting :
http://www.personalitypage.com/html/relationships.html
I think you’ll find it very useful. Definitely a long-term study, but you can benefit from the general concepts within minutes.
I’ll comment more later!
-Ken
Hi Evushka,
I like what you wrote. It is the seeing of one’s soul that brings the meaning and the love to one’s life.
Michael
Thank you Michael.
You reply brought me back to this discussion. And I just had a pleasure of re-reading all the comments.
Evushka
Hi Ken!
I will tell you the secret of my attractiveness. I was always treated like a princess by my dad, my brother, my mom, relatives and family’s friends. Plus, I did and I keep working on myself – look, character, habits, and skills. This is how I started when I was a girl: http://vancouverwomen.wordpress.com/2010/08/16/can-i-make-myself-beautiful/
I am happily married with my husband for three years. He tried his very best – he told me that since our first meeting he said to himself – “this girl will be mine!” He is strong and smart guy – he kept his word even through I drove him crazy.
What is attractive in men for a woman like me? Possessive attitude – if he likes he does his best; manly mindset – I can trust my man entirely and with him I do not need to worry about anything; outstanding way of thinking – he is always few steps ahead.
For me it is important to see him as the best man in this world. Therefore he needs to show me he is a hero. =)
I just recall another thing my husband did since we met. When another guys were around me, he put them out of competition right away behaving like a winner. Other guys could see that they didn’t have chances. I love and love this in my husband!!!
Very interesting text, Katya… I hope to read more soon.
BTW, are you in Vancouver Canada, or Washington state??
Thank you!!
I am living in Beautiful BC, Canada! The nature here is so beautiful!!!
It’s good to know. I hear there is a large FSU group in Vancouver.
I’m from Oilberta…. (Alberta if you haven’t heard that joke before)
I live near Calgary. For me, it’s hard to find a FSU girl that likes the idea of living on a farm…
Someday, I’ll find what I’m looking for…
wolverine, look for readers of Vladimir Megre. These people love and appreciate Nature.
thank you so much for the advice. I will look into it.
Hi Ekaterina,
I only had a moment to look at the site. Very, very nice art. I never get tired of art that captures the essence of the feminine form. I’m a fan of Adolphe Bouguereau and Richard Zolan for this same reason.
The site looks interesting and I’ll look at it this evening. I’m in the EST time zone.
Your comment:
“For me it is important to see him as the best man in this world. Therefore he needs to show me he is a hero. =)”
This is real men WANT to hear. Men WANT to impress, struggle and win the hearts of their women. How charming. Hahah…about the eligible sisters?
Thank you!
Ken
PS: Did you mean Possessive or positive. I could see a FSU lady using either one comfortably, but I want to know what you’re trying to say. By the way, a N/A lady would NEVER use the word “possessive”, yet in the proper context it would describe a deep bond in a good relationship.
Sorry, I don’t have eligible sisters. =)
I mean possessive: if he wants something, he goes for it.
Ekaterina,
It sounds like you found a really dynamic guy. I’m sure that if you are “The Best Woman in the world”, then it would be a very worthy task for your husband to be the “Best Man in the world”.
-Ken
PS: Ok,ok I’ll settle for eligible Cousins! Neighbors? Cousins of neighbors???
Ken
I’m with ya’ here, too. Where there’s one good (great) woman, there may be others . . . . . introductions are welcome. (winks and smiles intended)
My grandmother told me once: “When you are young and you meet the best man, keep it this way forever. Don’t look for other guys. Keep seeing your man as the best one.”
This is the words of genuinely Russian woman.
Sounds like solid advise Ekaterina, as usual.
Sigh, yes I have a rant. Don’t let anything I say reflect negatively on you or your work, I just have opinion and, as do others, use this opportunity to vent, share and learn. I like what you are doing.
May I share?
Tragically myself and a sizable number of men have tried to “See our wives as the best wives/women in the world”, long after this was farthest from the truth and enjoyed a long drawn out emotional/ financial/legal crucifixion for the effort that for some reason, leaves us a tad…frustrated?
Of course when you have a good woman that WANTS to look at and treat her husband as “The Best Man in the world”, she will be terribly hurt is he’s not worthy of her effort. Many men clearly seem great at first, but (Also clearly) later become completely unattractive on every level. They get lazy, fat, become detached, bland, dispassionate and cheat.
“Woman stays wonderful, man responds by becoming a pig”. This is true. Haha ,ask any divorced woman or her girlfriends.
Why do you suppose that is? What causes men to change? What happened to romance, love, respect, common dreams, passion, the thrill of living, the sense of responsibility, faithfulness, friendship, selflessness, honor, character, understanding, wisdom, values…? Are men void of the capacity to desire these things for a lifetime? Can N/A men or women even SEE marriage as a “Lifetime Deal” anymore?
How could so many millions screw up so much without “Knowing what happened”? Why so many surprises??
“The thrill of the hunt is over so Mr. Wonderful seeks a newer prize, or he just gets bored having conquered his woman”.
Heard that one?
Um, well it’s not particularly thrilling except to, perhaps the PUA. But what about the millions of good men that also WANT to be the object of their wives adoration and work to BE that man. They WANT long-term. They WANT to stay fit, stay involved, grow in romance, passion and understanding. Yet they end up on the refuge pile of broken relationship and families, not even worthy enough to remain involved in the lives of the children they created.
My bad. I’m venting.
Sigh…I feel better.
I guess that Good Men will always desire Good Women (Wherever they may be), so that they have a reason (And a passion) to remain Good Men. How simple.
If there seems to be so few women that we men feel we CAN be exceptionally good mates with in N/A, then of course we have to look elsewhere. Isn’t that wisdom, discernment, experience, common-sense, maturity? I may find a good mate (For my personality) in Atlanta. I’m not anti-N/A women as if holding a grudge. That’s childish. I’m just losing hope and interest as the years slip by. Everyday I work to become a better man with being a great husband in mind. I’m not alone, ladies.
Not to do a “infomercial, but I know it is common to assume that I must be a bald, 400lb man with bad teeth living with mommy. Thus the frustrated-single status. Well, I’m 5’10, 170lb with a 30″ waist, built like an athlete, perfect teeth, full head of hair, 45yrs old Caucasian with Spanish ethnicity, very well educated, have a small successful business, great friends, my own home that I, with my hands completely customized, I’m an artist, no addictions, no criminal history, Christian, single-parent for 13 years and (I am told) am a complete Gentleman in every way. Neighbors love me and I value character.
Perhaps I’m delusional but I THINK maybe, possibly I have something to offer.
That’s why I’m learning Russian.
You FSU ladies really are different. Thank you for being who you are!
Ken
I need time to explain clearly why men change overtime. What I want to point out now is that:
– There are women whose husbands had changed to their worst overtime
– There are women whose husbands had changed to their best overtime
My question is “what is the difference between these two kind of women????”
About the husband of my grandmother: he stayed at this best until she passed away. After her death he told us that he does not see a point living without her. And in few months his health, mind and lifestyle went to really bad state. When I saw him I could not believe that was my grandpa. And shortly after he quietly passed away too.
For many years I carefully watch many women and their men and I see what makes one man to stay at his best and other to get to his worst.
As a French person would say: Cherchez la femme! (“look for the woman!”)
As a point of reference, I’ve spent part of my life in the Midwest and the other part around the Northern Pacific Coast. My youth was witness to the earlier, militant days of the sexual revolution and my adult life walking through the rubble left behind by that conflict. Sadly, we have as yet to start the inevitably necessary rebuilding of the vanquished. That task is hard to accomplish since unfortunately, it is very hard to find any winners to do the rebuilding. Everyone seems to have lost the war. The battlefield scars are on the faces of everyone; not just the actual participants. Our offspring walk around ‘zombified’ by a fight they had no part in but are none-the-less victims of.
Middle aged men dream of the beautiful, young lover they never had and their female counterparts strut defiantly around like ex-Marines at a veteran’s parade. Young women seek true love while uncomfortable being truly lovely. Young men cower at the sight of these girls because they know it is only a matter of time before their spirit and wallets are broken by the very objects of their attention and affection.
In my life, I have always seen beautiful girls and handsome boys using their looks to get whatever they wanted, which was generally just each other. To that I have always said, “Good for them”. But those same people grow up to be beautiful women and handsome men who have never had a chance to learn about earning anything of value. Once taught to rely or depend on your looks for everything, it is rare that the trend wears out. Instead the pattern continues and the good looks have become a crutch of support as well as a device for manipulation.
All attractive people are not ‘bad’ just as all overweight people are not jolly, all skinny people are not hungry and all church goers are not holy. However, stereotypes don’t happen by accident. Many attractive people have had things given to them all of their lives and that creates a slippery slope for those who are interested in being around them.
But whenever we evaluate someone based on their looks and fail to consider the rest of their traits, we do an injustice to them as well as ourselves. We have lumped them together in a tiny fragment of the society and made assumptions about the rest of their personality which we have no right to do.
In high school there was a very attractive girl with wavy, blonde hair and piercing blue eyes. She smiled all of the time and gave everyone an ear when they spoke. As much as I thought of her it never crossed my mind that I was ‘in her league’. Even after she drifted away from some of the ‘in crowd’ circles and showed up in the party places, I still saw her as beyond my reach. Years went by, we both moved away and had marriages, children and divorces. Then at our 25th high school reunion I sat across from her at dinner. Whenever I glanced at her she was staring at me, not with the warm smile of her youth but with a look of calm understanding. We finished eating and walked to the bar where she said, “I had such an amazing crush on you in school”. I was stunned, and in fact still am, that she had ever felt that way. But the more we talked, the more I realized that I had never given her credit for who she really was. All I ever saw was the beautiful, blonde cheerleader. I had never taken the time to really know the warm, sensitive girl who would try desperately throughout her life, and many failed relationships, to just be loved as a whole person.
I think that the beauty we see in these girls from the FSU is for the most part their unspoiled nature. They seem as yet unaffected by modern thinking and social shortcomings. Let us never fail them by seeing only their physical charm.
Ekaterina,
Your comment: “For many years I carefully watch many women and their men and I see what makes one man to stay at his best and other to get to his worst.”
I hope you share more info. I love to learn, especially from your prespective as a FSU woman.
Any input from other ladies on Ekaterinas comment is most appreciated. Well, the Feminist variety might be asked to save the bandwidth. Hugs and kisses?
Ken
Ekaterina,
I very much appreciate your insight and also the little French comment at the end.
When I was dating my (ex) wife the women in her family always had bits of advice for me. They would always look at me and start with, “How you say . . . ” and then tell me something in a mix of Canadian French and broken English. One of the aunts who had been married for many years told me that the secret of a long marriage was to ‘never let the woman make you into someone else’. She gave me the best warning (which I should have taken more seriously) by telling me that a woman who shows signs of trying to change her man, I should run from as fast as I am able. But that was when the romance was new and some of those things seemed okay at the time. However now it is clear that some of the problems were already there. Years later after the marriage was failing, another of my ex’s aunts said she was sorry about how things had worked out, but my wife was ‘good at’ trying to make the men in her life change, often. That same aunt of my ex-wife also told me, “quand l’homme est changé vous devez regarder la femme”. (when the man is changed you must look at the woman)
It is my feeling that most men avoid change whenever possible. From my life experience, men don’t care much for change. Women, on the other hand, seem to thrive on change and it will inevitably seep into every area of their life, including their relationships and the men they are in those relationships with.
I never want to make it sound like all of the problems and faults are on the woman’s shoulders, because that would simply be absurd. There is plenty of blame to go around.
Yet one of the most common statements you will ever hear uttered from the mouth of a woman ending a relationship is, “He’s changed”, even though it was her goal and her commitment to change him all along.
Why aren’t most women content with the man they claim to have fallen in love with? Why do they feel that he is lacking some key component in order to be ‘the one’? And what’s more, why marry him in the first place if they feel he ‘needs to be changed’?
Maybe contentment in a solid relationship will never be enough.
There doesn’t need to be banners and fireworks every day or something new and different behind every door. One of the reasons men get married is to have stability, which by its very description is a lack of change. It seems so simple to me.
Life can be enjoyable and exciting without a constant pattern of reinventing and rebuilding.
The idea that your man will stay at his best is to keep him motivated to do something for his woman. You, guys, tell me if it is true for you or not!! Ok?
—- If a woman at her worst (clothes, body, character, habits…), overtime a man might not feel like contributing himself to his woman. He would get interested in finding another woman that is more attractive as a woman…
—- If a woman always criticize and shouts at him, he will not feel like being at his best. What for? She is never pleased anyways….
—- If a woman does not consider her man as the best, compares him with other men (even if it is only in her thoughts) and wants to change him, he will not feel like contributing to her. Why to do anything if Peter is better anyways?
—- If a woman does not love herself, overtime he will lose his love to her too. (Conclusion: if you want your man to love you forever, love yourself forever!!)
—- If a woman keeps harping on the same tune (“do this, do that” or “I think this will be better”), he will eventually stop listening to her or start looking for a less annoying lady.
Of course, both need to contribute to relationship. But relationship is the territory of a woman. She influences on the mood of relationship. If to say in modern way, she is a programmer of relationships, he is a active user.
Ekaterina,
Just opinions. Don’t hate me.
#1 Agree
#2 Agree
#3 Agree
#4 Agree that a PROPER self-love is needed for good relationships.
Disagree because it has become a Religion to “love thyself” to the point of insanity. THIS “level” of self-love is epidemic in America. Words that come to mind are “Princess Complex”, Narcissism, Arrogance, etc etc etc. I tend to associate with positive-thinking people with plenty of “self-love”, and so often, I, in MY experience see a very overdone, exaggerated degree of self-esteem, self-love, self-pampering, self-indulgences, self-ish-ness, self-awareness, self-actualization, self-centering that is way beyond the healthy self-love that I think you advocate.
Feminism in America, in my uneducated opinion, has used this amplified, arrogant, Western self-love to convince women that they are “entitled” to things that God nor man have ANY intentions of providing, and this “Supreme Worthiness” isn’t good for anyone.
Mainline Churches teach this crap from the pulpit! You DESERVE, you DESERVE, you DESERVE!!! (Oh…but you must tithe first, and tithe BIG) Can I put the lid back on this can of worms? Please?
Men are very susceptible to the “Prince Complex” as well. Women seem to call that confidence, boldness, masculinity, assertiveness, leadership and such. Yes I’m aware of the narcissists, though I find them extremely rare. They have to hold down jobs and noone rewards that behavior in our gender. Perhaps Self-Love and Self-Worship have become synonymous in the Feminist community. It does fit what I see.
#5 Agree
I’m glad that you want to teach women to love themselves, and I hope you accept my input only in the friendly spirit it is intended. Women suffering from a low self-esteem may also benefit from knowing that plenty of men WANT to adore them and see them as friends, lovers, mates and moms.
Bet that would lift men’s spirits if women felt that way about us. Hell, don’t worry about it feminist-influenced N/A women. We’ll find, marry, adore and love delightful women that DO feel this way. They deserve it. We’re men. We deserve it.
Cheers!
Ken
Ken, I was surprised to read things about self-love VS self-worship. I understand what you mean. It is very important to have balanced self-image. If not, we might miss the opportunity to see the beauty in other people too. =)
Ekaterina,
Sounds like woman’s main job in relationship is to be lovely, groomed sexy supportive and quite. I agree to an extend. It’s interesting what’s man’s job then, apart from being motivated by all those things?
Regards,
Kisha
Kisha,
How do you feel about man’s role in the relationship being nothing more than staying motivated by his wife’s support and self maintenance? If that was makes him a good and loving provider, would that be enough?
To my way of thinking, doesn’t it seem as if a man’s job in the relationship should be very much like the woman’s?
I think he should be supportive of her all of the time; acknowledging her for the contributions she makes for the family, building her up at home and also in public. If she is doing all she can to stand by him, he should in turn treat her like a queen; making sure her needs and desires are filled.
I don’t agree that her demeanor should ever appear as the obedient, little puppy that follows along on her husband’s heel.
However, I have seen women who are strong, integral components of the family and still keep their appearance sharp, professional or sexy as the situation calls for and also the everyday cheerleader that her man needs to keep him out there fighting the fight.
People can have self respect and mutual respect at the same time, don’t you think? If she is keeping her outward appearance nice because she always wants to look her best, it’s self respect. If she takes a few minutes to touch herself up when he’s coming home from work, that’s respecting him.
While the feminists would gag at the latter thought, it is not demeaning or self debasing to show respect for someone you love. Also, if the first thing he does at home is tell her how nice she looks and then he goes to clean himself up, isn’t that a good way to show respect for her?
* excuse the little typo, it was supposed to be,
“If that’s what makes him a good and loving provider, would that be enough?”
Dear Richard,
I actually replied to you yesterday but the post din’t come through.
I believe both partners should be respected supported and motivated. Pretty much in the way you’ve described.
As for looking one’s best. I noticed that a woman who’s well loved most often looks nice. But we all have our good and bad days, don’t we? And looking nice may vary, from a person to person. I kind of think I look nice in jeans and a hoodie, but this probably wouldn’t read as nice to me boyfriend.
Kisha,
We’re on the same page regarding the effort required to look good, and you are right on the money about ‘a well loved woman often looks her best’. There are also many guys I know who have ‘dressed things up a bit’ after meeting the right woman. It seems like a natural thing for us all to want to look better than usual for our date or mate.
But I also agree that some women can look ‘better than average’ in jeans and t-shirt or hoodie.
It kinda’ leans back to the whole self image thing in my opinion. A person who is confident and self assured tends to look pretty good in almost any attire.
Part of the huge disappointment in NA regarding a woman’s choice of casual dress is that they do not have that self assured demeanor and they carry a chip on their shoulder everywhere they go. When you mix everyday clothing with a bad attitude, the result can not be appealing. When we compare that to what we are talking about here with these attractive FSU women going the extra mile to add sharp clothing and a bit of make up for everyday use, it becomes very easy to see what entices us men.
After church two weeks ago I had lunch with a friend from our home study group. The church is a ‘come as you are’ sort of place so we weren’t very dressed up. The thing that stood out so dramatically while we were waiting for a table was that looking around the restaurant on a Sunday afternoon, we were the best dressed people there, and except for the waitresses we were the only people of normal weight, too. This is in a very average, upper-middle class place with a very average clientele.
Obesity, grubby clothes, bad attitudes and self righteous arrogance to top it all off; that is the modern ‘average’ which pervades NA culture today. I find it all amazingly sad.
If I may ask, how do you view a man who is clearly a little better dressed and groomed than most of the guys you see every day? Do you think he is trying to impress someone – trying to look hot for his woman – looking to pick up a woman – maybe more self confident than other guys – he must be gay?
Richard,
When talking about looking nice in a hoodie, I didn’t mean to say that’s what I usually wear or look exceptionally wonderful in it. No better or worse than in any other clothes. I just tend to think it may be more of an appropriate choice of clothes for me if I go for an evening walk in a park/sightseeing/ grossery shopping/dacha etc. then lets say my work gear. Of course I wouldn’t go to a wedding wearing a hoodie and claim it looks nice.
It actually depends on what to consider average. But generally if well-dressed/groomed person looks effortless and natural I’d be impressed. However if a man in whole looks like trying too hard/over the top then things like camp/trying to pick up someone would probaby prompt in my mind.
Can I reply? I have my hand up.
Kisha, may I ask a question? I’m really new at this blog / forum/ ranting thing, but find it very interesting to see so many points of view. I really would appreciate you letting us guys know what you feel men should do as their contribution to a marriage to a loving, feminine wife. What would make her proud of her man?
I’m a student here.
Thanks,
Ken
Ken,
I am sorry but it wasn’t me ignoring you. Just a general lack of time on my side.
What you’re asking from me sounds like quite a long essay. So give me a few days?
Kisha,
Thank you dear. I’ll look forward to it. Though I enjoy clowning around I really am interested in learning. This website has opened my eyes to help explain an underlying discomfort I have had with dating and seeking a mate in America. Though it may feel terribly offensive to some people, there is something incredibly valuable in the overall “theme” of this site. With our divorce rate (and misery rate) what it is I personally want to figure out how to do better or our childrens children will suffer as many of us have.
I know what feminists want from their men because I’ve lived among them my whole life (bless their unhappy hearts), so I’m most interested in understanding what very feminine, family oriented, FSU? women really hope to find in a man. I think this is common sense, but maybe I can gain more understanding.
Ekatrina mentioned ,”To be a leader, to be a supporter, and to be a Creator”!
I agree, but what would cause a woman to “fall in love” with her man again and again after 5, or 10 or 20 years of marriage?
I hope this doesn’t sound overly simplistic, but something or things deeply satisfy and fulfill women, always have and always will.
What are they?
Do some of you women want to learn what would satisfy a man in the same way, causing him to adore you and cherish you as you grow old together? As a man I can emphatically assure you, collectively the thousands of comments on this site will educate you with knowledge and wisdom and understanding that few women enjoy. Make it easier for us men to adore you.
Thanks for the opportunity to rant Kisha,
Ken
Ken,
here goes as promised:
As can’t tell you what all Russian women think I can only inform you what would make me proud of my man.
As many have already mentioned it here I think man’s main responsibility is to care about his family.
Every woman requires her own level of “care” and skills from a man to be able to “take care” of her in a way she desires.
I seek for:
- positive attitude in life
- good temper
- patience and kindness
- sharp intellect
- strong moral principles
I highly value
- generousity
- good sense of humour/with the ability to laugh at oneself
- DIY skills (very important!)
Hope that helps.
Hello Kisha,
Yes your information is very much appreciated.
Here’s some info you may find interesting:
I’ve read hundreds of “Online Dating” profiles from Russian dating sites (To study Russian women,not to find a date), and American dating sites such as Match.com and Yahoo (Which I DID use to meet ladies that I dated). (Nice ladies but NOT for marrying)
The ladies on the “Russian” dating sites describe what they were looking for in a man and it sounds just like your list Kisha. They want honesty, sobriety, good humor, chivalry, masculinity, a decent earning capacity (This is very wise), no addictions, never violence, no infidelity, love, warmth, affection, romance etc.
Interestingly many, many men WANT to be this kind of quality man which good women desire, yet many, many (N/A)women absolutely DO NOT want to be the kind of women that we men say WE desire.
Tell a man to become more manly, he will go to the gym. Tell a N/A woman to be more feminine and she doesn’t know what you are talking about. After all-She has boobs!!
How much more “feminine” does she have to be??
To continue:
The American woman’s profiles I’ve read over the last few years are simply unbelievable. If I hadn’t read them I wouldn’t believe it.
Out of the many areas that show misguided thinking I’d like to share just one:
One of the things that disturbs me personally is how American women, on their “Profile Page” have a long list of “Desired Occupations” for their prospective dates, and out of 15 categories they check off the only occupation categories that interest them in a man. Only one hinted of hands-on, trade-related work, and it was “Construction”. In other words either you work in an office in some capacity or you are a low-level, uneducated, low-income, undesirable “construction worker”. If a man works with his hands in America he is on a much, much lower social level than a man that may earn less money, but he has a cubicle in an office building. This thinking is very common, especially in the big cities, which unfortunately I live in.
For the record I own my own business which involves 50% woodworking/cabinetry (I’m a highly skilled craftsman in many trades) and 50% office work, design, sales, CAD., but THAT makes me a “Construction Worker” in the eyes of ladies that think that “Princesses” don’t associate with Tradesmen, even if I earn an executive income. I love woodworking and woodcarving. I get to do what I enjoy, but, heaven forbid, what will “Princess” tell her girlfriends???
I’m ranting. God I love ranting!
Women, on the other hand, can have any job under the sun from prostitute to President, earn a poverty level wage or be unemployed, and with a smile and tight jeans she is perfectly acceptable to consider for marriage.
Wow. I confused myself. I’ll have to think over what I just said.
I want so much for decent, good-hearted people, men and women, to find each other and create families. Kisha, the fact that you keep contributing on this site, in my opinion, means that you either are, or are becoming the kind of lady that men deeply desire.
-Ken
PS: If I may ask, is the name Kisha African American?
Darn, Ken, sorry for butting in. I thought I was through with my posting career, but here I go again.
If the average woman on American dating sites, like Match.com, etc., is representative of the typical American female, then I am a 6’8″ Russian Cossack. Match.com sends me “my matches” on a weekly basis(at least I think it’s weekly) and from time to time, I open one and read a few profiles. Sorry for stepping on toes, but those are the craziest bunch of dang people imaginable.
Oh, boy, I guess I will get hate mail from all corners now, but the truth is the truth. Anyone doubting should interview every lady coming and going in a typical supermarket and then interview their counterparts at Match.com. The differences would be striking, rest assured.
)
Kisha,
I think that what you desire in a man or what you believe the man should bring to the relationship is very reasonable and most men I have known would agree.
The thing that we men usually see however is a woman who claims that this is what she wants, but as soon as she finds a man to fit her needs, she then immediately begins trying to change him into whatever her next desire becomes. If we would all be happy with the person we’ve found to build a relationship with instead of trying to make them into someone different, I think we would all get along much better.
Your list of characteristics looks fine to me.
Ken,
Your writing cracks me up, but at the same time I can identify with nearly every word. We might be in some sort of parallel universe, my friend. (oh, wait, it’s just that we are in ‘thee’ universe and it’s filled with all of this strange behavior)
It was from reading literally hundreds of profiles of NA women on all of the ‘dating and mating’ sites that eventually led me across this site. I’ve been to all of the big ones; Date.com (fate.bomb), Fish in the Sea (carp out of water), Web Date (ill fate), Match Doctor (match 9-1-1), eHarmony (eek somebody), Zoosk (gad-zooks), specialty sites for different age dating, spiritual dating, wealthy only dating, plain old hook ups, cheating spouse dating, and about anything or everything else imaginable.
In my opinion, the bottom line on them ALL is: if this is what modern dating looks like, I want NO part of it.
I’ve written pages and pages of commentary about the overall traits of the women on those sites and it is a very dark and gloomy volume.
They all want to walk on the beach at sunset, they are all laid back and easy going, they are all of “average” build, and on and on and on. Well, I’m afraid that I just don’t buy it. Of the few I’ve actually met from such places, I wouldn’t spend a weekend with them, much less a lifetime.
Sam,
Make room for another “6’8″ Russian Cossack” in the ranks. Some of those profiles of the women on conventional sites is better than a Vegas comedy show.
Have you ever checked to see if guys write such ridiculous profiles on any of those sites? I tried it on one site a few years ago but then started getting badgered by straight men asking ‘what the hell I was looking at their profile for’ and by gay guys wondering if we ‘could get together’.
As the old song lyric goes; “What a long, strange trip its been”.
Ken,
I’ve never taken dating resources seriously. The idea of choosing a “mate” based on how he/she looks in the pictures and a short description which in most cases sounds like the one of a person with ego-mania does not seem appealing to me. Russian dating sites are no better than any other ones, in general it’s just how far people can go to seem appealing.
The reason I’n here I guess is to learn “the truth about Russian women”
Kisha is not my real name and I’m not a person of African descent.
Sam,
I always enjoy input so you’re not butting in.
I actually went on Yahoo Personals about 6 years ago and “tested the waters” with an impeccably honest profile. I never could understand why people embellish their profiles. I had email communication with about 100 ladies, phone conversations with about 70 or 80 ladies and went out on dates with 25 ladies over a 5 month period of time. Some women I dated for a while, and some I’m still friends with. I found it very easy to “screen” out the ladies that weren’t being honest or had issues that didn’t interest me, so no scary dates or surprises at all. They were all very nice in fact, and I really thought (initially) that 4 of them would end up being lifelong relationships.
People are very transparent and asking plenty of friendly questions saved me from any bad dates, clingy women or crazy people.
Now here is where I agree with you Sam.
5 years later (Nov 2008) when I tested the water on Match.com, it was a horrible display of selfish, narcissistic,demanding,unfriendly personalities. These sites are now bloated with fake or canceled profiles and it’s basically a fraud. NOT my original experience. I didn’t go on one date on Match, and canceled the trial subscription after two weeks, only to see my profile up for 20 months AFTER canceling it. The lies, the arrogance, the “Princess Syndrome” the fake profiles etc. These profiles read like a bad joke on humanity.
So I’m not naïve or just crawling out from under a rock.
However, with all that said, people reveal a lot about themselves in the profiles in spite of the embellishments which is why I can read them to get an understanding of the way women view themselves and what they believe they can expect from a man. Delusional or not, it is what they believe. It’s a great resource for this purpose.
No hate mail. It’s a mess and it’s too bad people screwed up what could have been a good thing.
Also I interact with hundreds of people a day so I’m not suggesting that Profiles provide anywhere near enough information to develop a well balanced understanding on the state of affairs in interpersonal relationships. It’s just one resource, albeit a very good one.
I’m glad to bring you out of retirement!
-Ken
Kisha,
Of course it would be quite futile and perhaps silly to “Choose a mate from a Personals Profile, a couple of images and a potentially embellished short description.” However, when I used the online dating thing I did actually date nice people.
Just for fun consider a mans (non-online) alternative:
If I meet a lady at the grocery store, talk for a few minutes over the kumquats; and agree to meet her for a friendly dinner the following night, she could be crazier than the worst of the online nut cases. Since I didn’t have the benefit of long phone conversations, I wouldn’t even know she’s a wack- job until BAM!!!, she stabs me with a steak knife at dinner. All because I DIDN’T HAVE THE PROFILE!!! And this is…safer?
I will never use another dating site, but it’s just about MEETING PEOPLE, not choosing a mate. If the “Princess Syndrome”, the lies and fraud haven’t saturated the sites I’d certainly be using them, but probably not any American dating site. I’ve dated enough locals for now.
Kishas a good penname. I’m not clever enough to use a false name.
I’m glad you’re looking at this site.
-Ken
Well, Ken, the lunch crowd once asked me if perhaps only the matches Match.com sent me were loony. Meaning, of course, that I am loony. Honestly, I think abuse from male friends is all that keeps me sane sometimes. I am glad you had a positive experience with some women at one of those sites. As for me, I was once on three Russian sites, but signed off the last one a year ago. Strangely enough, judging from the mail I receive, my profile appears on at least a dozen sites over there now. I have written several and asked for removal, but they just keep on sending “kisses”, etc. I can’t worry about it anymore, but, sadly, some advertiser is probably paying inflated rates because of fraudulent profiles.
Richard, I did check out the males at Match.com. I went on to view a local guy’s profile, in fact. On the way to his profile, I saw a bunch of guys posing shirtless in front of Harleys, and a several more of small town guys dressed in the latest metro fashions trying their best to sound very European and suave, suave, suave. By the way, I would describe the local guy as the only 49-year-old teenager I know. He was pawing on an acquaintance’s daughter on the first date, and the poor woman, 27-years-old at the time, was devastated.
Once again, it’s nice to hear some nice things about American girls. Since I seldom hear anything positive about Russian men, I have often wondered if the two sides ever get together to compare notes and comiserate. Though I don’t buy the stereotypes, can you imagine crossing a foulmouthed American gal in filthy surgical scrubs with a backside bigger than the nose of a Russian submarine with a bumbling, serial cheating, alcoholic, dumb Russian guy? Somebody please say something positive about my male counterparts in Russia and the FDR. Guys, I know you can’t be all bad.
Dear Sam,
Forgive my chipping in, couldn’t resist as Russian men is my favourite subject.
Russian men in general are less sexist and more respectful.
You can engage into a friendly banter with them and not fear about a foul blow. They are also very pleased to help with opening doors, carring heavy bags, car problems.
I had to ask my brazilian friend to be able to draw more objective picture. She stated that RM are romantic and prefer to go slow in the relationship and also try very hard to show that it’s not about sex.
Kisha,
It is not a job. Everything a woman does for her man, she does for HERSELF first of all. Truly, yes or no???
We do good things for others because we want to live fruitfully together – enjoy life together. Right?
What is better to give others – joy or frustration?
Ekaterina,
It is a job. We can argue about selfishness as a virtue, as it is actually a popular idea. But it still doesn’t answer my question and man’s role in a fruitful relationship remains unclear.
Kisha,
I guess I don’t understand what you are looking for here. How is truly loving your spouse and wanting to be your best to satisfy both yourself and them considered “work”?
At no time have I ever felt like it was ‘work’ to be my best for someone that I cared about. I didn’t think that looking my best, dressing my best, acting my best or trying to please them was anything more than a natural extension and result of my inner feelings for that person. Why is there a need to qualify those feelings any further than that?
I’m sorry but everything else has the look of “me first” feminism on the woman’s part.
Do I, as a man, “have to” explain my reasons for acting better around the woman I love or for dressing nicer when we are out together? Why not just be content with the fact that someone loves you enough to consider YOUR feelings in the way that they act?
Ekaterina began by asking about men who ‘change’ during the marriage and I contend that the primary ‘changes’ which take place over time are in the woman rather than the man. The biggest changes most men make after falling in love and getting married are toward pleasing their wife. Conversely, the most notable changes I’ve witnessed in women after marriage is a sense of boredom and unrest followed by lashing out at their husbands over their man’s lack of ‘flexibility’ (change) and ‘understanding’.
The only thing men tend to have trouble ‘understanding’ is what happened to the woman that they married.
When it comes to a “man’s job” in the relationship, it is my opinion that men and women have the SAME responsibility to EACH OTHER as far as supporting their spouse, showing their affection (in what ever way they know best) and to always seek self improvement for the benefit of the COUPLE and FAMILY as well as their self.
By the way, despite popular opinion, selfishness is NEVER a virtue.
Kisha,
If it is a job for you, there is no love in your heart for this man.
—–
Man’s role in relationship: to be a leader, to be a supporter, and to be a Creator!
Woman’s role in relationship: to inspire him to be a leader, to be a supporter, and to be a Creator!
=)
Wow. Even WITH my hand up I’m ignored. My poor, poor self esteem hurteth.
Sigh…Ok,I’m over it!
May I ask,
What IS a “fruitful” relationship? Money, children, equality, power? Happiness, love, romance, intimacy?
Educate me please.
Richard,
I’ve taken your point, but I was interested specifically in Ekaterina’s point of view on it. But she obviously decided not to give me any direct/coherent answer.
Kisha,
I can’t give you the direct answer about men’s role in relationship because it depends on a woman how a man would behave.
A woman is the energy while a man is the unit that is influenced by this energy.
For example, when a man wants to influence on relationship, it is very hard for him to do it – he needs to use rough methods. While a woman can influence on a man delicately – and he might not even notice it. It is like that because women and men have different nature.
Modern society has huge problems in woman-man relationships because women as men act only in outside (career). But who will act inside?
Just imagine: what would happen if earth and tree would function the same way????? It will be a chaos. This is what we have in our society right now.
Ekaterina,
First of all, thank you for opening this up the way that you have. Asking questions is a very important way to find answers, rather than living on assumptions and guess work.
Regarding the question of ‘whether a man will stay his best if he is kept motivated to do something for his woman’ I would have to say that the simple answer might be “yes”, but there is a lot that goes with it.
I believe that ‘most’ real men would choose to ‘do things’ for their woman if properly motivated. The real concerns are, what kind of things are being done for her and what kind of motivation is required. We can close with an answer to those two points.
For now, I will give you my take on the rest of what you’ve asked, and only under the parameters of an implied marriage relationship.
If a woman fails to take care of herself after a period of time, her clothing choices, her physical maintenance, personal habits and character, then ‘yes’ it is likely that most modern men will soon become disinterested. A good man will try to understand what is causing these changes and seek help on several levels. There could be serious reasons for her failure to keep up as the person she was when they met. Are there problems of substance abuse, is she dealing with mental issues such as depression or anxiety, has she already started being unfaithful, etc? But his tendency to be a leader of the family will have dropped off dramatically in the presence of a woman who has completely stopped being the woman he thought she was. While woman thrive on change (sometimes even if it isn’t for the better) men avoid change in nearly all parts of their life. Consistency and stability are mainstays of a strong male character. As far as whether or not he then seeks the company of a more attractive woman is only about 50-50. He might wait things out and hope for something to bring his wife back to normal, or he might just give up and look for someone else to handle his emotional or physical desires.
If the woman begins living in the “3 Cs” (complain, criticize and condemn) all of the time, a real man will back off quickly. Real men understand and appreciate the value of a strong and supportive wife. They know that if she is in his corner, no battle is too risky and no challenge is too great. Real men ‘want’ to be the knight in shining armor for their chosen princess. But they also know that a real woman is her man’s number one cheerleader, confidant and back up. He will do whatever is needed and most of what is wanted as long as she is his base of support. A good cheerleader is NOT a critic or a complainer and she would never condemn her man. But again, that does not automatically mean he will look for a prettier woman, a happier woman or any other woman for that matter.
When a woman constantly compares her man to other men, it is saying a lot more about the woman than it is about the man and real men know that song very well. A woman generally only starts that “after” she is already moving (or has moved) into another relationship, whether just mentally considering other men or actually involved with somebody else. A smart man will make the effort to find out the details of her unfaithful behavior while planning his departure from the marriage. Few things will EVER repair a marriage after infidelity. Most men will wait far too long to acknowledge and respond to their partner’s infidelity and it costs them dearly. Also, few real men respond to always hearing about other men by cheating so on that question/statement, he may withdraw but not much more than that.
I’m skipping to the last one next because it is closer to the previous two statements in that it refers to the woman’s outward actions and her demeanor within the marriage. When a woman is always harping on the things her man ‘should be doing’ it is the same as her saying, “I don’t agree with or approve of anything that you are doing”. It is more of the same old song, complain, criticize and condemn. If rather than bitching about what isn’t done she spent a fraction of her time acknowledging what he has done, that would multiply his efforts and accomplishments exponentially. This is NOT a theory. Science has given us many studies relating the value of supportive behavior in regards to overall human achievement, and there is NO data that supports nit-picky bitching as a motivational tool. It’s as old as the ‘more flies with honey than vinegar’ story. Women simply need to ‘learn’ to appreciate their man’s strengths and abilities rather than nag him about his ‘shortcomings’.
Now, the most important issue that you’ve brought up. How does a man love a woman who does not love (or respect) herself? And more importantly, how can a man continue to love her after she gets in that downward spiral of self loathing and disrespect? First of all, in MY opinion, the Biblical principle of the Golden Rule says it all: Do unto others as you would have others do unto you” and “Love thy neighbor as thyself”.
How can we ‘love’ anyone if we do not know what ‘love’ is? Love is NOT the excitement you get the first time you see someone looking hot and sexy. By the way, that is NOT ‘chemistry’ either. That’s ‘lust’, pure and simple. Lust is a physical reaction that is based on reproductive hormones. This is like gravity folks; you don’t have to agree with it but you’d better accept it. Love is NOT an instantaneous reaction to seeing someone attractive.
True love is a complex emotion which is built over time and with many deviations and distractions along the way. We do not automatically love ourselves, other people, or other things. We learn to love someone by being around them and developing a sense of commonality of purpose. Love is the way we respond to someone who continues our own thoughts and feelings. Love is different for almost everyone because it is deeply personal.
Love is never a simple thing. Nothing of value comes easy. Love may very well be the single most valuable commodity in human existence, so why do any of us assume that we should have it with little or no effort? How foolish!
Loving yourself is lesson ONE in loving anyone else. We must become at one with who we are before we can adequately express that feeling towards others.
Anyone who has become a parent probably understands that upon seeing that child for the first time, they found a new level of love which they had never before known existed. The immediate desire to be everything to that helpless little person who can’t even keep their eyes open, to become as close as possible and to figure out how to provide everything they could ever want right from the start; but only because we have hopefully learned enough about love by then to have that in store.
This is why children having children is so harmful to all concerned. Young people who’ve never known what true love is are having babies from completely physical unions and then are in some mysterious way supposed to know how to ‘love’ the child. It defies logic. We can not teach or share that which we do not know.
Until modern women are able to love themselves, they will not be able to love their husbands and in fact will not be able to recognize a sound and loving relationship even if they stumble into one.
With regards to the implication of men leaving the relationship or looking for another “more beautiful” woman, we must accept the fact that in today’s world (from a NA perspective) it is statistically more likely for the woman to stray than the man. Infidelity has swung in the direction of all other feminist teachings, well beyond the middle. It is not only highly possible for a bored housewife to engage in sex outside the marriage, it has gone from merely acceptable to being encouraged by many modern feminists. And what’s more, the manner in which women tie emotions to sex almost always leads the woman to ‘fall out of love’ with her husband and ‘in love’ with her new partner.
Back to the initial point about motivation, I think that the greatest motivator is bigger than good cooking, a clean house or even a tiger in the bedroom. If a woman wants the basic needs of her family secured, the motivation is as simple as being the man’s best advocate. Cheer him on when he’s winning and comfort him when he is facing challenges. Never be his critic, always be his crown. Never be his conscience, he already has one of his own. Be the light in his darkness, the diamond atop his treasure chest.
Ladies:
The more you are a real woman, the more he will be a real man.
If you can’t love him that way, your biggest problem is in your mirror.
Richard, you definitely get some sincere cheers from me. I cringe whenever I see a woman yelling at her man IN PUBLIC OF ALL PLACES. To a man, you may as well punch him where it hurts.
And speaking at someone with GAD(generalized anxiety disorder), I actually make an even bigger effort to look good when I’m having an anxious day. It makes me feel exponentially better.
Thank you for the cheers, Gillian.
I also cringe at the sight of seeing a man standing and doing nothing while his wife berates him. My thought is, ‘can I help ya’ there, buddy’? I just want to turn him around and ask why he’s taking it, but more importantly I wonder what benefit the woman thinks she can ever gain from acting like this at all, much less in front of others. It is surely a woman with low self esteem who could feel good about such a display.
Also, cheers to you too for acknowledging a personal disorder and being aware enough to work through it whenever it arises. That speaks volumes about your self image. Did you learn to deal with GAD by first watching or helping someone else living with a similar situation?
Thank you so much for the compliment! I didn’t really have anyone who could mentor me. I went to counseling a couple times where I learned how to do diy cognitive-behavioural therapy, and I’m currently taking a low-dose serotonin inhibitor. Most of my family and friends are supportive, but whether or not I succeed in life despite my disorder is entirely up to me. I do have to thank my six years of private school education for teaching me how to be self-assured.
Thank you all for your comments and opinions. Very interesting to see how others look at the things. =)
I just wanted to say that I recently saw a documentary film titled “Ballerina” which features Evgenia Obraztsova, the actress in the above clip from Russian Dolls. It follows Obraztsova and four other Russian girls as they struggle to become prima ballerinas at the Kirov. Definitely a must-see if you love ballet (as I do!) or if you are a Russophile!
This video clip is so touching, it actually brought a tear to my eye. I have been so completely immersed in school the past few months that it has made me forget such beautiful moments do exist. Granted, I know this is a movie, but I have witnessed similar events with my own eyes. Any woman who wishes to have good men like this in her life must make herself worthy of it first.
“I know that a new and kinder day will come. I would so much like to
live on, if only to express all the love I carry within me. And there
is only one way of preparing the new age, by living it even now in our
hearts.”
“I do believe it is possible to
create, even without ever writing a word
or painting a picture, by simply molding one’s inner life. And that too
is a deed.”
“I am in Poland every day, on the battlefields. I am with the hungry, with the ill-treated, and the dying, every day. But I am also with the jasmine and with that piece of sky beyond my window.
Esther “Etty” Hillesum
I have been reading excerpts from a book, published in 1981, that finally brought the letters and diaries of the late Esther “Etty” Hillesum to the world. Etty, whose mother, Riva Bernstein, was born in Potchev(Russia), chronicled life in Amsterdam during the German occupation. She has been described as a mystic. Because her writings meld details of her love life with descriptions of her spiritual development and musings, organized religions around the world have largely rejected her. That is indescribably sad because her ability to find joy and meaning in the face of hardship and her impending execution is a lesson for us all. I have placed all this here because I think Etty’s resilience and unique spirituality is something I have seen repeatedly in Russian women.
On September 7, 1943, Etty and her family were placed on a transport train to Aushwitz, Poland. From a window of the train she tossed out a card that read, “We have left the camp singing.” She died in the gas chambers of Aushwitz at age twenty-nine, on November 30.
Sam, with all respect I think was something different there, the spirituality you are talking about was most likely jewish and had little to do with her place of birth.
You may well be right, Kisha. But outside of spirituality, some cultures seem to find beauty, satisfaction, and reward despite life threatening dangers, economic distress, disease, etc.
I once watched a short video of a marketing professor from a wealthy country interviewing three men he happened upon in a very poor, very dangerous country far from here. The professor, rich from consulting with major companies and dressed appropriately, was incredulous. He couldn’t understand the smiles, the laughter and contentment he found in these men of little or no financial means. He, at first, seemed to think they were just ignorant of their “plight”, but further questioning proved otherwise. They knew full well what could be found around the world. They knew about shiny cars, overpriced condos, trips around the world, high thread counts,Ivy League educations, truffles and caviar. What these particular men had was a sense of place and meaning, strong families and friends, and work that allowed them to maintain a comfortable pace, enjoy communal activities and yet survive.
My country has spent decades tooting its own horn, and telling everybody else how to live, what to enjoy, and how wonderful things are here. Our financial system has its merits. Our system of government certainly does, too. I am not knocking capitalism, because I think it is the best of many bad economic systems. But the system has its demerits. One thing sorely lacking here is a real sense of belonging and meaning for the average person. There’s no denying that. I read about it every morning. I have personal anecdotal evidence, too. Esther Hillesum didn’t lack for meaning or a sense of belonging. Her spirituality was certainly part of the reason why, and I suspect her cultural heritage played a role as well.
Forgive the misspelling of Auschwitz……..
Really nice video. Natasha seemed so nice and cute. I need to find that movie.