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What many Russian Women think about Foreign Husbands

10/21/2010
By
Russian Women - Jenya Astana

Our friend Jenya

I passed the following article to my wife Lena and she found herself in complete agreement with it. Her twin sister and several of her girlfriends (see above) are currently dealing with the normal trials and tribulations of the single girl and the more negative aspects of dating in Russia and the FSU.

So in case you haven’t noticed yet…

It ain’t easy being a single girl in this part of the world. And indeed many of the married women also have more then their share of troubles as well. So with this in mind there has always been a great deal of speculation on behalf of these ladies as to what Men are like on the outside.

Perhaps one of you Gentlemen would care to write an essay to these ladies about what kind of Men you are? If you do I’ll be sure to get it properly translated into Russian and then post it on the site.

Women Talk: Russian Men don’t exist any more

by Svetlana Kolchik

Oct 19, 2010

Whoops, I didn’t say that because I feel bad already. Still, rumor has it. I’ve been hearing lately about the declining quality of our men from a growing number of women. A number so significant that it seems to me at least a trend, if not an epidemic. The nasty talk ranges from the girls’ lazy complaints about the local men to mere panic. And I don’t mean perspective mail-order brides striving to be rescued from the harsh reality of Russia — to some women, the grass does seem greener on the other side of the ocean. I am talking about the females who feel quite okay and accomplished at home, just somehow not as okay with “homegrown” guys. So the dating and marriage spectrum of these bright and pretty twenty-thirty somethings is gradually shifting towards foreigners — especially those in their league, fairly successful and open-minded.

I have to confess I can relate to this trend. The three years I had spent in the States in my early twenties did something to me — perhaps the CIA had secretly implanted a microchip into my brain when I was sleeping in my tiny room in the shared Columbia University housing in New York. But when I came back to Moscow, I immediately felt I had lost the beat with most guys there. On dates with what I call “typical” (not so well-traveled, don’t speak languages, sporting a macho veneer) Russian men, I often felt like an alien. Or rather, like an amateur actress, a Legally Blonde-type character, who had to pretend (for free!) she didn’t boast much more than an attractive face and a cool body. Many of my dates tried to entertain me bragging about the drinking contests in which they engaged while spending money across the globe (I must admit, some of my suitors happened to be avid travelers, just hopelessly narrow-minded).

I wasn’t entertained even though I did my best. Our perspectives differed, conversations stuck, it seemed I had more cultural differences with my countrymen than with my Manhattan pals. This was the case until I met my type of Russian — a Vladivostok-born self-made Cambridge grad who worked for an English bank and had previously spent about seven years outside Russia.

So when I started noticing that more and more of my female peers are choosing expats or Russians with a “Western implant” – a solid experience abroad, I kind of felt relieved. At least I was not the only one. “Boring, simply boring,” sighed Maria, a 27-year-old PR specialist as she sipped a cappuccino in a quaint cafe located in the downtown Moscow neighborhood where she shares an apartment with her 30-year-old husband, an entrepreneur from Vienna. She was implying Russian men, apparently a vague memory of her early youth.

Since then, this good-looking flirtatious brunette, a graduate of Moscow’s Tourism Academy, told me she had never fallen for the locals, and neither did most of her girlfriends. “When you learn languages and start traveling — especially to the West, your mindset shifts,” she said. “You start looking for a partner in a man, an equal. And it’s hardly possible to find one here in Russia.”

“Our men are so insecure,” Maria added, wistfully. “They often feel intimidated when they meet a strong successful woman. So for me, it has always been easier with a foreigner.”

Easier? Is it really? The varied marital statistics show that divorce rates tend to be at least 30% higher among international couples. The challenges include money issues, religion, other cultural differences and lately — the grueling legal battles over children. Even so, it appears that many Moscow-based females are brave enough to take the risk. My former classmate Anya, who, as a 32-year-old history teacher in college, leads a completely different lifestyle from mine — introvert, no globe-trotting, met her fiancé, a marketing consultant from San Francisco, online. They are expecting their first child this fall.

She insists she wasn’t looking specifically for a foreign guy and still has no intentions to move abroad as she feels quite happy in Moscow. “But most Russians I’ve been with, including my ex-husband, have either been chauvinistic or spoiled or just irresponsible,” Anya complained. The Soviet upbringing is one of the reasons to blame, she believes. “In a typical Soviet family, a woman, no matter how hard she worked, would do everything about the house, and that’s what most males still expect from their other half,” she said. ”

In Russia, many men grew up with single mothers who spoiled them badly. And then there are the teachers who are mostly female in this country — women are used to trying to accommodate men in every shape or form.” Whereas, with her American, who had left home at the age of 18, Anya said she feels “safe and secure.” “We share the chores and he even cooks,” she added, her face beaming with pride.

Yet Maria, who is currently studying for her MBA, talking about her marriage to her Austrian man, had often used the English word “empowerment.” “I feel empowered by my husband,” she said. “He believes in me and supports me in every way,” she said. I tried to find a valid equivalent of “empowerment” in Russian but couldn’t find any. But then I thought that perhaps many of our women have always been empowered anyway — but for some reasons may have been hiding it, at least from our men. Just like the old and a really popular Soviet song goes: “A woman’s utter happiness is simply a man by her side.” It seems that some newer generation Russian women are asking for more.

(original article can be found here)

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86 Responses to What many Russian Women think about Foreign Husbands

  1. Ekaterina on 10/22/2010 at 8:31 am

    In Russia abroad is portrayed as a fairy-tale land where people and life are much better than in Russia. And, of course, after seeing the world people (not only girls) start looking down at those who had never lived in other countries.

    Yes, after living abroad our mindset changes, our standards raise and it is tempting to look down at others. But I do not support criticizing Russian men (and men in general) because it is our inability to see beauty and light in every person. We get whatever we are willing to see.

    My biggest lesson in Canada was to learn to see light in every person – people from different cultures I met here and those who still live in my home town in Russia (even through they had never been abroad and do not speak other languages.)

    • Anonymous on 10/23/2010 at 8:58 am

      Agreed… Putting down men won’t get anyone anywhere.

      • Taras on 11/11/2010 at 4:56 pm

        Indeed, that is what far too many American women do to men here in the U.S., this one included. And they wonder why many men can’t wait to get away from them or they cannot find a husband? It seems Russian and American men have much more in common than I ever imagined, since the rug has been yanked out from under the feet of both without warning.

        Taras

        • Ravenna on 01/06/2011 at 11:01 am

          Why are Rossiyan women doing it to their men and our men fall for it? You’re assuming all Russian women have good intentions- and only want to submit to men. That is far from true, Russian women are independent and do not seek being submissive. This is a stereotype. It’s like calling black women belligerent, American people stupid, Black people drug addicts. You get the point. Women here behave no differently than women in Russia judging by the attitude most Russian females give here. Family is important to everybody-once it is proselytized it becomes phony overtime. Go to to Brighton New York instead of getting scammed online if you live in America-it’s a mini- Russia..

          Most men tell me they went through countless women to find a decent woman in Russia– they also point out that most the women search for attractive men, not desperate men. Russian women are polite because they are taught to be polite, not because they like then men they meet.

          I was the same way in the United States, and when you’re too nice here it only makes people think you’re phony. Men especially do not look for family life or children very easily. The men who do often hold strong religious or political values about these things.

          • rw_man on 02/01/2011 at 11:37 pm

            Hi Ravenna,

            I agree with some key points you bring up because of course there are many “bad” or “deceptive” Russian Women out there who are in serious survival mode.. And I’ve tried to make it a point to let guys understand what qualities they should be looking for besides just stunning beauty if they want to be happy for the long term..

            OK so here’s my point.

            When Russian Women are in survival mode there’s certainly great temptation for them to utilize the attention they often naturally get to exploit any number of men who wish to associate with them.. And yes unfortunately there are many bad stories out there and this is the classic negative stereotype that is floating around out there.

            BUT..

            (and i think you’ll agree with me on this)

            I don’t believe that most Russian Women (especially in Russia) are this way..

            Quite the opposite the vast majority of Russian Girls I’ve interacted with were loyal and caring to a fault…

            (For example many of the men that they dedicated themselves to frankly didn’t deserve this devotion in my mind due to their often boozing and philandering ways.)

            However right or wrong this is a simple and powerful example of “Mother Russia” at her finest.

            An underlying and burning desire to nurture her family at all costs..

            And this Ravenna is the bi-polar opposite of the mostly negative impressions you wish to impart on your Russian Sisters.

            I’ll do my best to be balanced as long as you do too.. deal? ;)

        • NelliRussianGirl on 10/04/2011 at 1:09 am

          man u dont understand
          Russian women allways appreciate good men
          we suffer from horrible absence of men in our coumtry
          like for example I have absolutely no men in my family
          most of them died of alcoholism during the 90s
          while the women made it through
          if I had at least 1 man in my family I would appreciate him
          but the only one left is my uncle
          he abandoned his family and works on ships
          I talked to him on the phone asked whether he wanted to marry again he said he doesnt need it
          I myself when I lived in Russia allways looked for a good guy but all I met were alcoholics
          the few good guys I met treated me with indifference
          and arrogance
          if I had met 1 decent guy I would have given him al the love that I had but all the want is a one night stand
          now I live in Germany and I see the differencee
          in Russia I saw mostly women on the streets
          here I see young cute men as well
          in Russia I only saw women with kids here men take their kids out to a walk spend time with families
          sorry but this is true
          Russian men dont want to be men
          they have so much choice of girls they feel like they dont need to change

    • Dmitriy L. on 10/21/2011 at 11:44 pm

      Even though this article is one year old, the truth spoken by the author is eternal. I agree with Ekaterina wholeheartedly.
      A female friend of mine told me once that the men who are rich don’t respect women and treat them really bad. I started to think why that happens and it didn’t take me too long to find the answer. A lot of women are driven by material comforts, i.e., “..wonna have a rich husband and all that comes with it” totally ignoring their own hearts or loosing faith in Love. Rich men on the other hand didn’t get rich by being stupid right? It is obvious to those men that they wouldn’t be “loved” othewise, i.e., if they were poor. It is very sad to think that someone loves you only for your money. Now, I have met women, at different times of my life, that loved me just for who I was even when I was poor. That’s why I can’t blame all the women in the entire World for being inherently material. I know for a fact that there are some good women out there, no matter what the race, nationality, or the color of their skin who have true hearts capable of loving even when you are poor. These women are precious, priceless, premium, they are a hard find, and those who find them should treat them like their queens. There are men like that too, they are also a hard find, and those women that find them should treat them like their kings.

      • rw_man on 10/22/2011 at 10:29 am

        Well spoken Dmitriy.

        I’ve met my share of both materialistic and non-materialistic Russian Women. And the materialistic ones are only setting themselves up for a very short term ride. But as you know fools exist everywhere.

  2. Ekaterina on 10/22/2010 at 6:08 pm

    I would like something else.

    Some years ago I met one man. He had never been in university, he didn’t even finish high school. But he was successfully doing his business. When I visited his home, I noticed that he didn’t even have books!! He didn’t read anything. For a highly educated girl like me :D it was weird. At the beginning I was about to look down at him, but then I thought “Education and books does not mean that a person is stupid. I should not label a person like that!”

    And later when we kept communicating, I was amazed how smart and wise this man was!!!

    But if I had not opened my eyes properly, would I be able to notice his intellect??

    • Taras on 10/23/2010 at 10:25 am

      You are miles above most people, who judge the package and not the contents. I judge people no so much from how they look, but using the Biblical adage about “By their fruits you will know them.” In other words deeds paint the true picture of a person, and you clearly understand this. Being able to see people for what they really are is the key to true love and happy marriages, to say nothing of health relationships. You’ll succeed in life at whatever endeavor you seek, and you’ve got intelligence where it counts. I wish more women were like you……:-)

      Taras

  3. Richard on 10/22/2010 at 6:55 pm

    Ekaterina,

    I really enjoy the way you’ve described your travels and life experience. It is helpful for others to see how open you are with your thoughts and perceptions. Many people will share only a conclusion without ever telling how they come to it.

    One observation of mine after beginning to travel was quite different from the statement you make about ‘looking down on others who haven’t lived in other countries’. What I find myself feeling for those who never had such an opportunity is a sadness for what they have missed, but a great appreciation for what they have. I’m now able to appreciate some of their stated values more realistically. By knowing that they have never lived outside of a small radius from their place of birth, I am able to better see why they sometimes feel the way they do about world issues.

    I sure agree with you as far as how much our own mindset can change after living somewhere else. Even short stays in central Mexico and Italy have had long lasting effects on my thinking. I respect some people and their lives a great deal more now, for certain.

    We are blessed to have had the chances we have in seeing more of the world. I try not to take for granted my good luck in that regard. I get excited at every chance I get to go somewhere new.

    It seems that you have discovered and learned something valuable regarding education and personal value. Because I don’t know enough about the effects of advanced education on the average person in other places, I can only speak to things here in NA. One of the most profound realities here is that the more educated some people get, the less intelligent they act around others. Most people that I have met in other countries don’t brag about their education constantly while acting like complete morons. Here it is unfortunately quite the opposite. We have hundreds of thousands of people in NA that will go out of their way to tell you how ‘well educated’ they are, but the more you know them, the clearer it becomes that they have used little, if any of their education to better themselves in life. That characteristic has always left me inherently distrustful of people with a lot of formal education.

    I was once told, ‘if wisdom came from books alone, the whole world would be wise’. I think that wisdom comes from learning as much as you can and then applying all that you’ve learned as often as you can.

  4. Taras on 10/23/2010 at 10:15 am

    This destructive pattern is destroying the prospects and futures of untold millions of white men here in my country. I can understand why Russian women are turning to foreign born men for husbands, but the grass isn’t always greener on the other side of the fence. Russians and Slavs in general need to start supporting each other and helping them to form families. It seems the cancer of feminism is going to decimate the Russian people just as it’s doing the same to the native white population here. Russian and American white men have much more in common than they dare admit, they are losing their chance to become husbands and fathers, they are losing their role in society. Women do not seem to grasp cause and effect, and in the face of this intensifying hurricane, men are getting angrier and angrier like the way the ocean does here in the face of an oncoming 150mph hurricane.

    Taras

  5. Jim on 10/24/2010 at 8:47 am

    I don’t know about you guys, but I wasn’t particularly impressed by the article quoted in the post. The author sounds like your typical insufferable western cow, but in Russian form.

    • rw_man on 10/24/2010 at 2:30 pm

      Point taken Jim..

      This author did write for the Russian version of Marie Clare Magazine so that shows you where her background is.. However besides her personal rants there were some real grains of truth in the contrasts that she has observed in her travels. And for this point alone the opinion of her and other Russian Women she wrote about is worth expressing here.

      • Jim on 10/25/2010 at 7:16 am

        True. Also, the claim about divorce rates for international marriages being 30 per cent higher sounds unnecessarily conservative – all the statistics I’ve seen in Western countries show that marriages between domestic men and foreign women have lower divorce rates and longer median length until divorce.

        BTW, when’s the second part of the “A Day in the Life of a Russian Girl” series coming out? The first part was fascinating.

        • Richard on 10/25/2010 at 9:45 am

          Jim,

          One of the stats on divorce rates around Seattle a few years ago backed up what you are saying about the average length of those marriages between domestic men and foreign women as well as an overall lower rate of divorce.

          However, the breakdown of a larger description of foreign to domestic marriages also included marriages between domestic women to foreign men, which threw the scales back in the other direction.

          Sighting higher instances of spousal abuse as the primary reason, the rate of divorce between domestic women and foreign men was nearly double that of the national average when the study was completed.

          Another factor for the earlier example being more successful was said to be the ages of the individuals being married. The best rate of success was with domestic men from 36-50 years of age marrying foreign women between 26-35 years old. (the majority breakdown actually showed most marriages within an age range of about 6 or 7 years apart and in the mid to late 30s) These people apparently had a more mature understanding of expectations for marriage and better overall communication skills.

          It was actually reading about that sort of study which first set my mind thinking on the possibility of seeking a partner on a different continent.

          • Jim on 10/26/2010 at 5:40 am

            Thanks. I was under the impression that the foreign man/domestic woman marriages were such a small proportion of total foreign/domestic marriages that there wouldn’t be enough of them to throw the statistics like that. Obviously such marriages must be more common than I thought.

      • Westerngirl on 10/26/2010 at 1:49 pm

        To be honest I can probably understand the complaint that Russian men are not acting lazy, not responsible, etc. But as Jim pointed out the author also comes off as making feminist quotes. I never believed in the grass is greener on the other side quote when it comes to people. I am sure women outside of Russian are making the same complaints. Especialy in Latin countries. I know an American woman who was married making the same complaints about American guys (except said nothing about a man cooking or being empowered by a man).

  6. Kisha on 10/28/2010 at 4:35 am

    Men are men no matter where they come from. If you happen to find one which is good for you in your home country – good on you, if not it doesn’t mean they don’t exist.
    In most cases I would advise against Expats who are commonly called Sexpats here and that is for a reason.
    The article is aimed to please “sex and the city” type of audience. The same one she was writing for in Marie Clare.

  7. sam r ogilvie on 11/13/2010 at 8:50 am

    The late Ronnie Van Zant and Steve Gaines, Southern musicians and songwriters, were and are often called rednecks, but, nonetheless, were masters at pathos. In this song, they write about societal, in fact, parental advice, that they found lacking and untrue. It’s all about love. Here’s the lyric for the song “I Never Dreamed”:

    (Ronnie VanZant — Steve Gaines)

    My daddy told me always be strong son
    Don’t you ever cry
    You find the pretty girls and then you love them
    Then you say goodbye
    I never dreamed that you would leave me
    But now you’re gone
    I never dreamed that I would miss you
    Woman won’t you come back home

    I never dreamed that you could hurt me
    And leave me blue
    I’ve had a thousand, maybe more
    But never one like you
    I never dreamed I could feel so empty
    But now I’m down
    I never dreamed that I would beg you
    Woman I need you now

    It seems to me I took your love for granted
    It feels to me that this time I was wrong, so wrong
    Oh Lord now I feel so lonely
    I say woman won’t you come back home

    I tried to do what my daddy taught me
    But I think he knew
    Someday that I would find one woman like you
    I never dreamed that it could feel so good, Lord
    That two could be one
    I never knew about sweet love
    So woman won’t you come back home
    Oh baby won’t you come back home

  8. Stuart on 02/25/2011 at 12:49 am

    Russia isn’t the place to be a single Englishman, believe me! I’ve lived here for more than four years. The opportunities for dating and marriage are sparse, because of the feminism cult spread here from other countries. Most women I’ve met are looking for EDUCATION, CAREER and FINANCIAL SUCCESS! Any man looking to marry, the best thing to do is travel back to the nineteen forties or fifties. Sorry I can’t be of much help, I just don’t have any other suggestions.

  9. Richard on 02/25/2011 at 10:38 am

    Stuart,

    I think that in Russia, like every other ‘civilized’ nation on the planet, feminism has been the best selling “bill of goods” of our past 50 years. It was never about equality or fairness and it was not born out of need, but rather pushed on society as the key component in implementing a breakdown of the traditional family unit. It was purely political and never in the best interest of the people.

    That said, we all must accept the reality that despite the declining moral standards, there are still wonderful women everywhere, but finding them in any concentration becomes harder with each passing day.

    Of course Russia and the rest of the FSU are seeing and feeling the effects of feminism and the younger the female adult population is in your area, the greater this will stand out. Also, as rw_man has said many times before, the bigger cities are far more prone to this tendency than smaller towns, villages and rural areas.

    But that is also true here in NA. I no longer consider the Seattle/Vancouver region as the sort of environment that I would want to seek female companionship in. Part of my near term plan is to move back to a rural community somewhere in the Midwest where my young daughter has the best opportunity to avoid growing up surrounded by the welfare mentality of most modern, NA women. I have previously written here about the things I hear being discussed by some of my daughter’s friends. It disgusts me and offends my daughter. In all honesty, it would be highly hypocritical of me to try teaching my daughter the sort of values that I hold to while simultaneously dating women around here who stand in defiance of those very standards and principles.

    Maybe the last four years in Russia has been an eye opener for you in regards to the overall culture there, and I sure won’t dispute your experience about it, but think about the bigger picture. Are you in Moscow or St. Petersburg or some other huge city? Are you in your 20s and dating the club crowd within your age group? There’s an old saying where I come from; “you don’t go in a pig pen to milk cows”. If the sort of woman you are looking for is one of high morals and character, it is very unlikely you will find her running around with women who lack those traits.

    The underlying purpose that I’ve found to this site is that there are still some places in the world where traditional family values thrive, and that parts of the FSU seem to be a more likely location to search for women who believe in those values.

    By the way, where do you originally come from? Your homeland experiences may have some bearing on the perspective you have of your current situation.

    • sam r ogilvie on 02/25/2011 at 11:55 am

      As always, Richard, you have submitted an excellent, thoughtful analysis.

      I have spent my lunch hour at a popular Russian(former republics site) called VK or Vkontakte. Though it may seem a bit odd for a man my age to frequent such a site, it has been a great educational experience. I have a dedicated handful of fine young girls and women that gladly answer my questions and enlighten me on cultural differences and the current state of affairs in their respective towns and cities. As I have found in America, profanity, heavy drinking, an obsession with popular culture(mostly American), wild premarital sex, materialism and all the other ills are common with young women in the small towns and big cities of Russia. The good element remains, though. I wouldn’t hesitate to allow a young girl the age of Richard’s daughter to spend time with many of them.

      Stuart, you have lived there and know a great deal, but I do believe you are searching in the wrong places. Search my name at VK and send me a message if you desire. I will point out some fine young women, and you may decide to contact some of them.

    • Kisha on 02/28/2011 at 3:18 am

      Oh Richard don’t start this big city VS villiage thing again. There are nice and rotten people everywhere, notwithstanding the area.
      And drom my expirience women FROM big are cities are often the ones of high morals and characher, however morals may differ.
      Which promts the question:
      Have you got an idea what’s rural Russia is like?

      • Richard on 02/28/2011 at 3:19 pm

        Try not being overly defensive, Kisha. My personal experience between “city” girls and “country” girls is long and clear. Of course that experience has almost entirely taken place in and around North America.

        As you must not have noticed, my reference to the same sort of phenomenon possibly existing in Russia was from statements made by rw_man in other places throughout this site. I believe his experience speaks for itself and I openly bow to his expertise on the subject as it pertains to life over there.

        Of course there are good and bad people everywhere. That should go unchallenged. However, if any traceable factors begin to show any significant patterns, then we’d be fools to deny the results. Here in NA we have stronger, longer lasting marriages (on average) in small towns and rural locations than in larger cities. The same holds true for infidelity and other things which might point to moral character.

        I guess the only other thing I can say to this is don’t shoot the messenger. If I see any change in the trend I will be equally willing to share my enlightenment.

        • sam r ogilvie on 02/28/2011 at 8:17 pm

          Hi Richard,

          Here’s one of my favorite country girls(Champaign,Illinois and Nashville, Tennessee). If her voice is not heavenly, please tell one that is. Though I am sure you are familiar with it, I hope you will take the time to listen, and report back. She’s a first class person and so are the guys in the band. It’s been said every generation, but decent, courteous people are always in the minority. I think Stuart has realized that and you, long ago. The trick for me is trying to dwell on the good and let the bad slide. I let the f… yous here and there and the glares out on the roads ruin my day at times. How does one exhibit sensitivity to those in need, but not let the other side of the sword destroy him?

          • wolverine on 02/28/2011 at 10:36 pm

            I like allison Krauss, and union station…

          • Richard on 02/28/2011 at 10:44 pm

            Sam,

            Oh yes, Alison Krauss has the voice of an angel for certain. She’s one of those comfort stops alone the busy and tedious highway of life. That’s a great song, too. I guess some of us find too much personal connection to those lyrics. Why else would it move one so. Another thing that was clear as soon as the video began is that she and her band are more concerned about the music and the message than how much glam and glitter can be jammed onto their fans. Even some of the country and country/rock performers are way too far into the presentation to let the music stand on its own merit. Great songs are enough for me now, but I hold no ill thoughts for those who feel that more audacious is better. There were numerous acts that I’ve seen over the years that just got up there and made music. Those are the best memories I have from live concerts.

            I don’t know if the decent and courteous people are always in the minority, but I suspect you are right. As it is with the worst of humankind. Minorities only stand out because they go against the accepted norms. Yet as these minority groups expand from each end of the scale, it is the common majority which disappears and those extremes face off in conflict. After the dust settles and everyone starts drifting back away from the extremes, normality returns to the mass majority. Just the cycles of life, I suppose.

            Keep trying to dwell on the good, as I often try to do as well, because that is what maintains our sanity. But letting the bad slide is (to me) like letting the new puppy pee on the carpet.

            That which is right has a responsibility to those who might not recognize what is wrong. I’m guessing that one day we will live to see a much clearer and much more important line drawn between good and bad. There will be a lot of people stunned and confused, but it will usher in a change like no one has ever seen before.

            Though your question is probably more rhetorical, I’m the wrong guy to ask about showing sensitivity to those who will pat our shoulder with one hand then almost certainly stab us in the gut for pocket change with their other.

            I have not yet learned to turn the other cheek unless it’s while I’m throwing a left hook. I came up in a time and place where the philosophy was; you help me and I’ll help you, but you step on my foot and I’ll knock your teeth out. Years of that programming followed by moving to a city of over a million people makes for a lot to overcome when some clown cuts you off then gives you the solo finger salute as if it was your fault.

            But there is justice coming. We simply must understand that it is not for us to hand out and be content with that. I’m told that one day “all” will be explained to my complete satisfaction.

            Beyond waiting for that day to come, I am convinced that a mature and loving relationship with a person of character can go a long way to ease many of those stressful life situations.

          • Richard on 02/28/2011 at 10:50 pm

            I even re-read my response before sending it and still there’s mistakes. (like “alone” instead of “along”) Sorry.

          • sam r ogilvie on 03/01/2011 at 8:23 am

            Richard and Wolverine,

            It’s always a pleasure to find others that appreciate the same things you do!

            I need to check my notes and determine the exact date, but several years ago I made my way down to the front at a local music festival called Merlefest. Though I have always loved music of all genres, I was almost completely ignorant of the folks that were classified as Bluegrass musicians or defined by the broader term as Americana artists. So, when Alison Krauss walked out and took her position at a mic literally an arm’s length away from me, I had no idea what to expect. The stage height has been raised considerably since then, but it was really low at that time and I could look into Alison’s face without raising my head at all. What transpired was a really special thing. The girl’s voice truly caught me off guard. How could one describe it? It was infinitely feminine, pitch-perfect, inviting, warm, ethereal, and, like a classic instrument, it seemed to interpret and define the lyrics with a soothing, penetrating emotional appeal all its own. She’s naturally humorous, yet definitely shy. Between songs she lightened things up by bantering with her band and cracking a joke or two, but when singing her eyes often teared up and her sensitivity was starkly apparent. There’s no question in my mind that she’s one of the good ones. She’d help you out of a ditch or die trying, I think. There’s nothing like a dose of femininity, goodness and sincerity to lift a man’s spirits. Those brief bursts of light keep us going and point to greater things beyond.

        • Kisha on 02/28/2011 at 10:34 pm

          But you still didn’t answer my question “what do YOU know about the RUSSIAN countryside”.

          • Richard on 02/28/2011 at 11:37 pm

            Well Kisha, if you are trying to get me to say that I’ve never lived there, I think that I’ve already made that point quite clear over the past couple of years.

            What I “know” of the Russian countryside and rural communities comes from family and friends who have been there or lived and worked there, as well as what I’ve read about it in literature and the media, the artwork I’ve seen and enjoyed which has come from the region and also the writings from rw_man and other people on this site.

            What I “believe” about rural Russia is that it is a place not completely unlike rural North America in many ways, or rural England or rural France or rural ________ as well.

            Rural life has a distinct style compared to suburban life or inner city life. At least that is what I have observed in every country that I’ve ever seen. That applies to the European countries I’ve been to, the Asian countries I’ve been to, the South American countries I’ve been to and the Caribbean countries I’ve been to.

            So what is it that YOU are trying to say? Is it just “this big city VS village thing again”? Are you trying to say that there is NO difference between the life styles of Russian people in a big city of 1 or 2 million people and that of the Russian people who live in a village of 2 or 3 hundred? I simply do not believe that. But only because I have never seen it or heard of it anywhere.

            Or are you trying to continue your position that there are good and bad people everywhere? (which I have also said many times on this site)

            I am pretty well traveled, pretty well read and I make a conscious effort to do my homework, as it were. Trusting the information which is available to me whenever possible and attempting to apply deductive reasoning to that information as it compares with other sources is a key part of intelligent growth and interpersonal relationships.

            If you live in a big city Kisha, and you and all of your circle of friends are of high moral character, that is GREAT. You have my support. But if you live in a city of a million or so people and think that because you and your friends are very dignified and because of that are also specifically indicative of the overall morality of that city, then I would beg to differ with you. The numbers will never support that claim, I’m afraid.

            Now on the other hand, let’s say you live in a town of 3 or 4 thousand people and the closest “major city” is more than a few hundred kilometers away, and you still find that most people you meet from that larger metropolis are the people of higher moral character, then I submit that you simply have not met enough people from the big city. Again, the numbers won’t bear it out.

            People are people, Kisha. And whether they live in Russia, Canada, Hong Kong or the US, they tend to follow certain patterns in life. The pace, the demands, the competition in big cities hardens people MOST of the time. They are more likely to become jaded through their mere proximity to “the action” and thus are also more likely to loosen their morals as a form of defense mechanism for survival. It is not any form of criticism or condemnation; it’s just how MOST people react to that environment.

            Please notice my use of the word “most” as opposed to “all”. The reason we are able to have these conversations and use statistical information to support what we say is because thousands of people spend millions of dollars and entire careers compiling this data. We don’t need to rely on emotional opinions when there is such an over abundance of data out there.

            I may not personally like the way things are in much of the world today, which I’ve also made quite clear a few times, but I can’t change that reality by simply disagreeing with it.

          • Kisha on 03/01/2011 at 9:35 am

            Richard,
            Why I asked the question is because rural Russia is in fact very different to what you may see or expirience in other countries. Because there’s no rural Russia in a way.
            A bit of staistics: 82% of Russian population is urban. And There are 11 cities with more than 1 mln citizens Moscow, Saint-Petersburg, Novosibirsk, Ekateringburg, N Novgorod, Kazan, Samara, Omsk, Chelyabinsk, Rostov, Ufa.

            Village in Russia is traditionally applied to a settlement which citizens are involved in farming. So in villages you will have private houses, farms and gardens. In Soviet times communists used to build what they called collective farms, which employed people from a few neighbooring villages.
            Nowadays a village with 30-40 residents is a big village. There are no villages with 200 or 300 people in them, not anymore. There are usually very few young people in villages, because they prefer to leave to bigger locations as soon as they can, the only ones who stay in their villages are old women. Traveling trough the country you will see lots of deserted villages, houses falling apart and trees growing through the roof. According to year 2005 statistics there were 39 000 of abandoned settlements of different types in Russia. In last 10 years 12 000 villages and 290 small towns disappeared from the coutry map.
            The village population is declining with every year. Collective farms no longer exist and former farmers in most cases unsuccessfully battle alcoholism. Grovin up in such environment can’t be easy, the hardship of such life developes the kind of personalities that will do whatever it takes to succed in life.(And success is most often measured with money nowadays) Which, u understand doesn’t really go hand in hand with high morals. There are exceptions though, but it’s not the kind of life most people would enjoy, and like to have. And it’s not surprising majority try to escape.

            Next, there are little towns, formed around a factory or millitary objects.(Probably with 5-10 thousand people) There people live in block of flats and have jobs as local shop assistant or maybe a hairdresser ot a teacher, or a factory worker. Pace of life there is slow salaries are low and kids don’t want to stay there either. Because as they put it “there are no prospects and there’s nothing to do” and everyone wants to be rich and famous so they also migrate to bigger cities.

    • Stuart on 03/01/2011 at 1:19 pm

      Hello Richard,
      I’m from a middle-class business family in England. I live near Moscow and I’m 47. Thank you for your comment, which I enjoyed reading. I’m VERY old-fashioned, by the way and like to keep myself to myself. Maybe that’s got something to do with my situation here. I don’t even enjoy the entertainment here, to tell you the truth. Actually I’m not too bothered by my lack of social life here, I’ve come to earn a bit of money, really. But what I read on the internet about Russian women astounds me….

  10. sam r ogilvie on 02/26/2011 at 7:31 pm

    Stuart,

    Here’s some of your former neighbors, Irish folks actually, performing a song written by a former North Carolinian, Ryan Adams. Whether you like the music or not, it’s a taste of home. Bono’s methods are often questioned, but there’s no questioning the fact that he cares and he’s trying to help where he can. It’s important, I think, to keep in mind that there’s a remnant out there of good people.

    • Stuart on 03/01/2011 at 1:23 pm

      I don’t like modern music, actually. Thanks for the thought anyway.

  11. Renee on 03/02/2011 at 1:50 pm

    Richard, for what it’s worth, I thought your post of Feb. 28 to Kisha was a very good answer. Her description of rural life in Russia bears many similarities to rural life in many parts of NA, I think. I come from such a place, where there aren’t a lot of jobs and many of the young people leave (as I did). But whenever I go back home to visit, I am struck by how much nicer and less prone to belligerence these country people are.

    • Richard on 03/02/2011 at 3:18 pm

      Thanks Renee.

      I grew up in a very rural setting with the closest town having about 20 families and only a general store which was open mostly for the owner to have something to keep himself busy during retirement. There was also a farm implement dealer who was only available by appointment because he had his own farm to run as well. All of our other needs meant going to “the city”. There were about 5 or 6 towns close by that had populations between 50 and 300 people, then one or two that were over 3,000 and next was a city of about 25,000.

      Certainly I agree with you about the similarities “back home” for us, although it may be even more pronounced in Russia. There are a few places in my home state where the buildings are mostly standing, but the people are long gone. Whoever still owns much of that land just lets it set there, slowly being reclaimed by nature. I know that most of my friends couldn’t wait to get away from that seemingly stagnant existence, though most of them never did. Of course I was the same for wanting out and I made my escape, but now I really look forward to going back and showing my daughter around all of the places that I grew up in. She greatly enjoys the pace back there and wants us to move back while she is still young enough to experience it as a child.

      The town we moved to when I was about to enter junior high has grown from a population of 3,460 in the mid 60s to a whoppin’ 4,180 last year. Actually, I’m surprised that it’s grown by over 700 people in the past 45 years since there is no industry there and the farmers are barely getting by.

      Almost all of the small farms I new growing up are gone. When I was a kid, we used to have grange farmers, something like the collective farms that Kisha talks about in Russia, but even those have shut down back in my region. Grange members used to decide cooperatively about crops and livestock based on the needs of each member and there was a lot of bartering for goods between them. The federal government got their dirty little fingers into that back in the 70s so most of the granges became undefined or simply closed. Currently, a farm of under a thousand acres will have a difficult time surviving and a single bad season could put them under. Its all pretty sad, really.

    • Kisha on 03/03/2011 at 8:06 am

      I like country people too, but that mostly applies to the old generation.
      Real rural life would be without water, heating etc. In the village my distant family owns you have to bring water from the sping which is 2 km away if you want to have a cuppa tea or wash up the dishes.
      In the cold times there is a big stove to keep you warm, which you have to keep a supply of logs for.
      My close friend bought a house in the village few years ago, she has spent a fortune on renovating it already, the state it was in was not acceptable for living. She’s got a lovely house and a garden now but only because she has been putting so much effort, work and time into it, the rest of the villagers prefer to live in mess and ask her to give ‘em money.

  12. Stuart on 03/03/2011 at 1:50 am

    The Russian women in your photos are very attractive. Every man’s dream. If you knew what such women were like to try and go out with, though, you would look elsewhere. I think it’s wrong to mislead foreign men and put their hopes up. That’s what I think, ladies and gentlemen, for what it’s worth. I doubt if you take my views seriously, though. I’ve only lived here for 4 years.

    • sam r ogilvie on 03/03/2011 at 5:37 pm

      Hello Stuart,

      As the grandson of a Scotsman, I am really interested in knowing how you think females living in the UK compare to females living in Russia. What are their similarities? What are the most obvious differences? Do you think it’s harder to attract the attention of Russian women than it is women in the UK? I realize we are speaking in terms of your experience and your perceptions, but I am interested in your point of view. I think we all have a tendency to generalize and catergorize, because it is our nature, but individual opinions are important and interesting to me.

      • Stuart on 03/05/2011 at 2:37 am

        British women are fatter, more masculine, more full of themselves, more practical, more open, more polite, their compassion is falser, they are scruffier, have much more worldly knowledge, better educated (at school) by far (even though it’s not much any more), and very unpleasant to go out with if you’re not a wimpy chap. They have much higher and more sophisticated standards of taste partly because they have seen more. Russian women look prettier and dress more like tarts, British women dress like they don’t care (because they don’t!). British women are even more feminist than Russian women and hate men who generalise about men and women and think they should be different(me)! Russian women are much more introverted than British women and less sociable. They want to be bossed around partly because they are too lazy to take responsibility for much. That’s the way I see it. Thank you for your interest.

        • sam r ogilvie on 03/05/2011 at 2:29 pm

          I am really thankful for your input, Stuart.

          If time and resources were infinite, I think it would be great fun to live in several different countries for an extended period, and quietly observe people. I have enjoyed sitting in inconspicuous places that offer a view of passersby since my youth. A brief encounter provides a motherlode of information about the personality and character of a person on occasion. It has proven difficult for me to move from the individual assessment to a corporate assessment, though. Someone comes along and upsets my neat definitions, categories and generalizations, it seems. As I have said, though, generalities have merit, and provide some comfort to us. They provide a starting point for those of us determined to learn about and understand others.

          Human nature is not so easily defied. It rears its ugly head in the most humble burgs and the largest metropolises. Just last week, a lunch buddy described the medical practice his son enjoys in New York City. A psychiatrist, he plys his trade with the government by day and on his own in the evening. His clients are largely wealthy widows who need company and a sympathetic ear more than medical help. As the hours tick by and the $250.00 per hour fees mount, they talk and he listens and takes notes.

          A few miles away, no doubt, a woman sits surrounded by family and friends and laments the fact that she can’t afford a 5th Avenue apt. and the lifestyle that comes with it.

          If nothing really made itself into everything. Then “everything” is truly an assemblage of lives lived in desperation. There is a remnant, Stuart. That I know. The remnant is a group of shes and hes living a life apart from this despair, and the foolishness of the masses. I hope you find one of those girls, Stuart. I really do.

          • Stuart on 03/06/2011 at 7:05 am

            Thank you for you kind thoughts. Alas, I think it maybe a little wishful thinking, on my part, to find one of those you speak about in this neck of the woods. I feel rather out of my depth here.

          • Richard on 03/07/2011 at 12:34 pm

            Sam,

            The more I read of your past, the more I think we grew up in some sort of parallel universe. I have also been a people watcher since my youth.

            When I first got a license, I would drive to Chicago and hang out at O’Hare Airport where I would just sit and watch people coming and going for hours. Usually I would open up a camera bag and pretend to fiddle with lenses and check out shutters, but all of the time I was taking candid shots of loving reunions and tearful good-byes. I was fascinated by the military troops coming and going because we were still in Southeast Asia at the time and I wondered how many were coming home verses how many were leaving that would never come home.

            My cameras have always been my shield for people watching. A good friend and fellow shutterbug once said, “Never leave the house without a camera and never think about whether or not to get an image”. He always told me that if your instinct was to lift the camera to your eye, never second guess it. Shoot first, and then work it out later. It took me several years to reach a point where I would assess the situation before deciding to capture an image, and in all honesty I still struggle with it at times.

            People are so vastly interesting to observe and they are constantly changing. Looks, attitudes, appearances, etc; and you can’t freeze every moment. Certainly any parent knows first hand how tough it is to get every special moment on film.

            All that aside, there is something else you said which has had me thinking quite a bit. The part about, “everything is truly an assemblage of lives lived in desperation” and then a “remnant that is a group of shes and hes living a life apart from this despair” both got my wheels turning.

            Speaking of slavery to their jobs and careers, Henry David Thoreau said, “The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation”. Comparing this to the “shes and hes” around us every day, I wonder if we have all become equally enslaved by a modern, twisted and deformed vision of our own emotional worth. Has this highly technical and overly mechanized world trapped us into servitude as we endlessly seek approval and satisfaction from sources that can offer none of it to us?

            Who is, and where is, this remnant “living a life apart from this despair, and the foolishness of the masses”? I wonder also, are we a part of that remnant or merely deluded into thinking that we might be? What defines us as individuals separated from those foolish masses?

            I suggest that in the simple knowledge and acceptance of those differences, we find the exit.

          • sam r ogilvie on 03/07/2011 at 9:15 pm

            Hello Richard,

            I think you are right about the parallel universe. I was amazed to discover kindred spirits in the few states I lived in before coming home in my late 20s. I mentioned one in another thread, a friend I made while living in Louisiana, that I haven’t seen in years. He called over the holidays, and we picked up like we had seen each other daily. He has a love for observation, too. I guess there’s several of us still alive and kicking here in the States.

            I should apologize for getting on my high horse or stepping into the pulpit when making my last comments. I was trying to say that most of us strive to find happiness and satisfaction in seeing our ideologies proven superior,our achievements, recognition, and material things, despite seeing the misery that mentality brings all around us. Often, we fail to do things for the pure joy of it, because we expect some recognition or remuneration out of everything.

            In America we have seen mostly consolidation and centralization in the business sector. Instead of 30 thriving, family-owned businesses on Main Street, we have the local Super Wal-Mart. At the local Wal-Mart, the manager and pharmacists make good livings, but the other employees are starving to death. The one time owners of those family businesses were the stable backbone of their communities. Typically, they had a passion for what they did, an expertise now unknown, and the satisfaction of being the boss and having the authority to deal with customers on their own terms. The same can be said for many other sectors other than retail. Community banks exist, but three banks or so command most of the mortgage business and deposits. So, I think you are right. Most of us are servants of masters that offer little to us.

            I think a remnant exists, though. Despite the fact that they are in less than ideal positions or situations, I see men and women that manage to live above the fray,or on a higher plane, so to speak. They are oblivious to the Jones and strong enough to be themselves without being proud or cavalier about it. They quietly express their values through action, are quick to smile and are always available to lend a helping hand. I have heard those folks called the salt of the earth, and, you know, they are. I would like to thing I belong with that group, but many days I find myself looking for the exit. That might have something to do with age. I’m relatively happy, but if a fine chariot swung low this evening, I would be one of the first onboard. :)

        • NelliRussianGirl on 10/04/2011 at 12:31 pm

          Nelli RussianGirl
          sorry man but useem have met the wrong women all along
          if u dont like russian girls why do u visit this forum?
          we dont like to be bossed around we just find it sexy when a man can handle a situation
          i would let my boyfriend decide where we go on holiday not because im too lazy to make this desision myself but because I like to be suprised
          u say british women are more educated
          with whom have u been interacting in russia – with high school students?
          russian girls are educated only one needs to speak their language to have more sophisticated conversations with them
          not every Russian girl had a chance to learn English
          how many British femalaes have a perfect knowledge of foreighn language?
          Russian girls have far less possibilities but thats not the reason why we have lower standarts then British women
          we are not Goods to be sold for a cheaper prize
          we just appreciate the inside beauty more then a thick wallet and perfect manners
          you complain about British and Russian women
          and Im sure there are some realy nice women out there in uk
          u compare 2 types of girls like two types of cars
          compare their price and abilities thinking on how to make the best trade
          man u should stop looking for the cheapest car with the best look
          start searching for a SOULMATE
          it seems like u see women as enemies
          dont be so arrogant
          open up ur heart
          try to share the world of the woman u meet
          if its a russian woman learn some russian
          try to be a bit russian urself
          if its a British woman Im sure she has a lot to offer as well
          I love how British women are so kind and easy going and have such cute funny accents
          u say they r not pretty enough??? man start looking for a kind girl and buy her all those sexy clothes u wanna see on her
          try to invest some more personal effort really
          dont compare women like that
          best wishes to u=)))

          • NelliRussianGirl on 10/04/2011 at 12:33 pm

            it was a reply foor stuart

    • Richard on 03/03/2011 at 7:45 pm

      Stuart,

      I don’t think it is so misleading for someone who has lived there to gain different perspective than someone else living there when you both come from other countries. Neither you or rw_man were born and raised in the FSU so you are both transplants and the reasons each of you had for going there, the length of time each of you have been there and the area you are each in, would all play a part in those differences of opinion.

      Another thing to consider is whether or not you have similar interests once landed in a new country. If one person arrives as a part of their career, it would be much different from someone who decided to change their life direction by packing their belongings and heading to a country they’ve never been to with plans of calling that new place home.

      But like Sam, I am interested in the overall difference between the ladies in your homeland verses those in the part of Russia you currently find yourself. I’ve spent time in the UK and for the most part found the women there to be very open and friendly towards foreigners. Much nicer than places like France or parts of Italy.

      Does your work give you much of a social circle with locals? Are you comfortable mingling with strangers at social events? How about giving us some more details about what your daily routine is like and what you do to unwind around the place you live now.

  13. Renee on 03/06/2011 at 8:28 am

    Hey, Richard. I was reading your post of Stuart on your finding English women to be “much nicer” than French or Italian women. That was kind of funny for me to hear, as a woman — not because I don’t find it to be true; I don’t have enough experience with any of the nationalities in question to have an opinion — but because in fashion magazines, in films, etc., French and Italian women (especially French) are the ones the rest of woman kind is supposed to emulate. You know, their inherent stylishness, their mystique, etc., makes them so much more attractive than other women. Superior. Certainly I love the style of many European actresses from the late ’50s and early ’60s. But did you find their lack of friendliness outweighed any “style advantage”?

    • Richard on 03/06/2011 at 11:09 am

      Hi Renee,

      Thank you for your thoughts and question.

      It might be that traveling through these countries with limited time to become friends with the people sets up an unfair perspective for evaluation, but it just seems as though every region has its own “personality” as it were. That is the same for the whole rural verses city thing that I’ve talked about recently.

      The English women always felt open to me and the people I’ve traveled with. They didn’t seem to care where you came from or what your next destination might be, they were generally quite friendly and helpful.

      In Paris (the only part of France I was able to see) it was hard to get a response from women no matter how casual the question or situation. I saw it as an overall attitude which was carried out with the population in general.

      Italian women varied widely in their personality (again) based a lot on whether we were shooting or just sightseeing in a big city, small town or countryside location. However the basic impression was one of curiosity and friendliness, almost childlike, but not at all lacking in maturity or character.

      The relative beauty of each of these areas was pretty equal. The styles and demeanor changed noticeably however. English girls were more prone to a casual look compared to their French counterparts, but that was emphasized greatly by going directly from London to Paris and then back to London. An average working woman in her twenties on London streets looks very nice but definitely never over dressed, very much like Chicago or Seattle. The Parisian girls looked very much more concerned about meeting the current trends in attire, which makes them “look” quite enticing, but that is just appearance. I found the Italian women to carry the majority of that European mystique you spoke of. Throughout Italy, a woman’s fashion sense varied widely but all of them carried themselves well and gave off a real sense of desirability. The only thing that changed upon meeting and chatting with them was a bit of suspicion that they carry towards foreigners. It wasn’t bad in the smaller cities and villages, and almost disappeared in the very rural regions.

      To answer your question, I have always tried to put a person’s physical look on a totally different plane than their personality. This is not to say that I am some sort of high brow, self righteous, always fair person who never allows himself to be swayed by beauty. I’m far too human for that. But it is important for people to know me before casting dispersions on my character, so I try to always offer the same consideration to them.

      Being raised in a small farming region, I am clearly enchanted by beautiful women. Where I grew up we didn’t lack pretty girls, but familiarity sometimes breeds complacency. Being a photographer has allowed me to see beauty on many levels and to be honest, I miss my roots in this regard.

      European women will probably have a certain hold on me for as long as I live with regards to their look and style, but warmth and a friendly attitude will outlast appearance every time. One you merely put on and take off based on the prevailing mood, where as the other you are (as we say back home) glued to even when you’re naked. In other words, it is who you are that’s important, not how you look.

    • Stuart on 03/07/2011 at 8:37 am

      I suppose it wasn’t true for the younger women, only the older ones.

      • Richard on 03/07/2011 at 9:59 am

        What do you mean, Stuart? What part wasn’t true for the younger women? What are you calling younger or older; age range?

        • Stuart on 03/08/2011 at 9:47 am

          I can’t give an age range. Generally, the younger the women, the more difficult it is to get a word out of them. British women are more likely to give you a mouthful of abusive language than Russian women if you ask them a simple question. Such generalisations are difficult to make. I haven’t found a good apple yet!

  14. Gillian on 03/09/2011 at 12:16 pm

    Happy Belated Woman’s Day everyone!

  15. Kisha on 03/17/2011 at 8:33 am

    More stories on Russian women, men and what not from the same blog, in the same “Sex and the city” style… if you fancy:

    one on Russian men…that apparently they want to get married
    http://en.rian.ru/columnists/20110111/162101013.html

    on Russian women in search of a dream husband
    http://en.rian.ru/columnists/20101116/161359398.html

    Russian women again…
    http://en.rian.ru/columnists/20110315/163020510.html
    and femenism
    http://en.beta.rian.ru/columnists/20110208/162506463.html
    and harassment
    http://en.rian.ru/columnists/20110222/162719181.html

    • Richard on 03/19/2011 at 12:09 am

      Kisha,

      I’m curious what it is you are trying to say with these links from Svetlana Kolchik’s column.

      Certainly, as a professional writer, Miss Kolchik is articulate and she clearly does a pretty fair amount of research (or has it done for her as many other writers do) in producing her articles. But what is it about her writing that you are trying to interject here?

      I think it very fair to say that she is quite “westernized” (for lack of a better term)in her writing and she draws on sources that represent modern business success from her region, or lawyers who are intellectually suspect to most intelligent adults. So how does that all fit in to what ever point it is that you wish to make?

      It doesn’t seem as though Miss Kolchik is a voice of common ground or middle of the road thinking. She writes for a publication that is pretty much feminist in origin and content. What is it about her stand on the topics you’ve linked that might enlighten us or change the feelings of the majority of readers on this site?

      • Kisha on 03/19/2011 at 1:57 am

        Richard,
        I post the links to the articles because a) they are written by the same auther as the one in Rw post b) they are about Russian women, therefore I conclude quite relevant.

        And Richard do I really have to give my personal opinion on everything I post? I don’t think so. I was merely providing more info from the same sourse, on the same subject.
        Personally, I don’t like her writting style, but that’s me.
        There are number of things I disagree with, and a few I would agree with. She just can’t help contradicting herself in her each article. That’s the point.

        • sam r ogilvie on 03/19/2011 at 11:36 am

          Hello Richard,

          For middle-aged Western men like you and I, it is very difficult to discuss topics of great importance without referring to our Christian faith and using it as a point of reference. After all, it really determines who we are, or one might say it is our essence.

          The dilmemma is that in a pluralistic world it is not socially acceptable to discuss one’s faith in the context of broad social, economic or political issues. Most of us are sensitive to the feelings of others, too, and that sensitivity transcends social norms. So what can you or I, or most men, say in response to the writings of someone like Miss Kolchik? Well, we can address the heart of the matter(the heart of the problem is the problem of the heart) or we can tiptoe around and pretend that these issues are not truly spiritual in nature.

          In my opinion, Miss Kolchik and several thousand other women around the world have no anchor, no center of gravity, no infinite source of reference. That’s obvious because they are buffeted about, their opinions are all over the place, they are majoring in minors, and seeking satisfaction and fulfillment in things beneath them. Life to them is image, the next shiny acquisition, and sex is a sport, not a gift that involves the deepest form of communication and what was designed to be the expression of unselfish, true love between to people committed for life.

          One can only pity the men hitched to them. I know several, and their lives revolve around the next trip, which is expected to fill a void their wives feel, recharge their exhaused bodies and also serve as a quest for enlightenment in a new place populated by “unique” people, the next re-do of a room in their homes(one just done last year, by the way), the next car, and the next edition of Cosmo or some other trashy rag that addresses the latest fad or recycled religion (that’s just the thing they need to address their unhappiness). Of course, enduring a nightly retinue of Hollywood lightweights on either the silver screen or television is part of the prescription for a happy life.

          Oh, Brother, what happened to quiet, moonlit walks through an enchanted forest or along a remote beach?

          • Richard on 03/19/2011 at 1:33 pm

            Sam,

            Great post, as always. I totally agree with the apparent dilemma that many of us face in this “pluralistic world” you speak of.

            It might be my overly simplistic, naive, farm boy background (or what many would just refer to as being a simpleton) but I don’t often see a need for concern regarding whether or not it is “socially acceptable to discuss one’s faith in the context of broad social, economic or political issues”.

            I go out of my way to make it clear that most modern social norms offend me enough that I refuse to conform to them as often as is possible. If it labels me as uncaring, idealistic or as an arrogant ass, so be it.

            Some people out there will always have to look at guys like us (who still hold on to the foundations that we believe in) as misfits, old fashion or whatever. I can live with it.

            A particular young person that I’ve had many talks with recently is struggling with relationships that are very modern, fast moving and somewhat lacking in depth or value, so she’s beginning to feel like that is all that anyone can hope for now. My goal has been to convince her that with all that she has to offer, she should never “settle” for any relationship which she does not find comfortable, just to be in one.

            Her spiritual life is working for her but her social life is looking sparse and cold. At her age, she sees a loving, Christian based marriage and family as her heart’s desire but finds very few young men looking for the same.

            When I look at the state of affairs facing young people today (on this continent at least) I worry for them. I would not want to be a twenty-something with firm values in place, and searching for a partner that shares those values. It is a dark landscape, in my opinion, for both genders.

            The paths still exist through those enchanted forests and along those remote beaches; but walking them alone falls a bit short of our expectations.

          • sam r ogilvie on 03/20/2011 at 8:46 am

            I admire your position, Richard. I guess I am very much a product of the old American South. We were taught from birth to avoid talking about religion and politics if at all possible. That mentality or approach has its merits, but, as I said in the last post, it’s hard to pretend anymore.

            I admire your young friend, but I am optimistic. I think she will find a like-minded young man in due course.

            It is an undeniable fact that human nauture trumps culture, discipline and the best of rules and regulations. However, people of faith can be recognized because they are guided and supported by someone that has overcome that nature. I am too old to play around anymore. At the social site, VK, that I have mentioned several times, the friendly and helpful people are the people of faith. In my community and my country, the friendliest and most helpful people are people of faith. That is no accident. I am with them. Though I fall short time and again, my intent is to do the right thing and be a force for good. I have grown tired of superficialities and the filth I see. I am not alone, and I am very thankful for the company I am able to keep. Russia has its share of those people, and I think their influence is apparent.

            Keep up the good work, Richard.

          • wolverine on 03/20/2011 at 6:10 pm

            I kinda understand your young friend. I’m kinda in the same boat. Not that I have trouble getting dates. Finding a decent girl is hard. The saying from proverbs that a good woman is rare and valuable beyond rubies is true, but I’d prefer to say that she’s harder to find than a top quality ruby, or ultra fancy diamond.
            People around me in the Church are kinda interesting. They think I go out of my way to misinterpret the Bible, and then argue the misinterpretation. Aparently going through the King James Bible and using something that would be a period dictionary to find the definitions is not the correct way to read the bible… (used Blacks Law Dictionary which is that period of english) The Bible looked like a completely different book to me after I did parts of it like that. Certain things made sense that didn’t before, etc.
            Now, because I disagree with their views and their so called experts, I’m a heathen looking to twist the Bible for my own purpose, and to justify what I’m trying to do….. That’s actually backwards. I looked for the interpretation the completely reconciled, and then followed that….
            What’s my greatest sin in the eyes of these people?? I don’t let them take advantage of me, and I don’t let them walk over me, I don’t let them tell me how to live my life, and I”m not like them. They come out to my family farm, and talk to my folks about how I’m a heathen, and not following in God’s path, and how they’re praying for me…
            Considering how they act in everyday life, I’m considering being called a heathen to be a compliment…

          • Richard on 03/20/2011 at 11:02 pm

            Wolverine,

            Many self proclaimed Christians fall short in the area of understanding and acceptance for anyone who might question their conclusions. Not very Biblical of them, is it.

            I can empathize with you 100%. There was a very long time in my life when I went with the version of spiritual knowledge that was being shared from the pulpit. After seeing what seemed to be a lot of variation in interpretation and understanding of some pretty basic scripture, I took the mature path and decided to use my own brain to determine what these passages really meant. Low and behold, my ideas weren’t always in line with whatever particular church or preacher I sat before.

            I’m currently working on a paper entitled, “Keys to a Successful Christian Experience” which begins with the premise that it is the personal responsibility of any believer to ultimately rely on their own best judgment and understanding. If someone is to believe that they were created by an all powerful and highly creative god, then it would only stand to reason that they would have been given a brain sufficient to determine for themselves what the scriptures are saying. I don’t say that you should ignore the vast amount of intellectual material out there from highly educated scholars in the field, but they are also just human and every bit as prone to error as any of the rest of us. And at the end of the day, they are only giving us their opinions.

            I personally think that if you are sitting with a King James Bible in one hand and the Black’s Law Dictionary in the other so that you might best understand the old English writing, you are far more committed to that understanding than those who would condemn you for the effort just because it doesn’t always jive with their way of thinking. The “correct” way to read the Bible is the way that works best for you. The people who sit in judgment of your manner of study need to spend more time on their own.

            Another part of the paper I’m working on deals with denominations and the difference between Bible doctrine and church doctrine. Chances are you will face that battle as well since you have chosen your own study path. My best tid-bit of advice is to follow the old adage, “to thine own self be true”. If it is your own salvation that you seek, why not let it be by your own journey that finds it?

            I read Biblical writings daily from a number of sources. It may be the Bible itself, or it could be works that relate to it or published studies on various theologies, but it is “what I do” so to speak. There are millions of written pages debating every aspect of religion imaginable, yet frighteningly few of them are any more valid than our own impressions reached by merely picking up a copy of the Bible that you’re comfortable with, reading through it, and coming to you own conclusions.

            Enjoy the journey and don’t worry about what others say.

            Now my personal disclaimer: There are tens of thousands of people who read the Bible regularly and still have no clue what it really means, or they are so far off that it defies logical thought. I don’t support obvious misinterpretations of the Bible which lead to hatred or bigotry or any philosophy contradictory to the fundamental principles that are taught within it.

          • wolverine on 03/21/2011 at 1:13 am

            Richard, if I might, I would say one thing. Not all necessary is found in the Bible that we have right now. 22 books were stripped out of the Bible as we know it. Numerology is important in the bible, and 6 is considered the number of the devil and death. 8 is considered the number of life.
            There are also many thing in law of which we must be aware of. Much of man’s law is contrary to the Great Law (the laws of God and of nature which are both inseparable.) So, how can one follow your conscience where it is at odds with the laws of men?? Does one just disregard the Great Law to avoid time in the clink?? Or does one find a way to create an exemption for one’s self IE make one’s self above the laws of men??
            An example that I found and had several major arguments over with several who claim to be christians. Proverbs says that a wise man leaves an inheritance for his sons and his son’s sons. Now, with these estate taxes, and the government wanting to raise the percentages on the estate taxes to the point that one would barely be able to pay leftover bills with the leftovers, how does one do that?? Everyone gave the ‘render unto caesar the things that are caesar’s’ answer…. I asked what if I could make it so that caesar doesn’t have a claim???
            That got all kinds of indignant answers calling me rebellious, prideful (which I readily admit is one of my demons but is irrelevant in this case), lawreaker (whose law is highest?), not paying my fair share, and a bunch of other stuff simply not repeatable here….
            Another two contentious issues that I have with ‘christians’ is the whole marriage thing, and the idea that the kids are theirs (The second that the mother signs for the birth certificate, that child belongs to the government as a slave no and’s, if’s, or but’s). The child with the birth certificate is now ‘under bondage’. Bondage we think of as overt slavery with chains and whips. Not true. A bond is an obligation to perform a duty in simplest terms. The birth certificate is a bond which makes the bearer a surety for the debt. It’s very similar to the lien on cattle, really. Christ came to lead us out from under bondage. A lot of this stuff is so blatantly obvious, and most people can’t see it even though they talk about it every day.
            The marriage certificate/license. That’s a biggie. license is permission to do something that is illegal or forbidden. Ther certificate is a contract, when signed it’s a 60/20/20 contract. 60% of the contract is with the state. 20% is each with the husband and wife. That’s actually polygamy in my book. making the state the controlling partner in your marriage is not exactly a good idea in my book. ‘What God hath joined together let no man break asunder.’ State is an artificial entity, not a man, so it isn’t included in that statement.
            Many Christians get their necks out of joint when I say that. ‘If there is no license, how can we prove we’re married…’ Or my favorite, ‘Who will know that we’re supposed to be married?’
            Well, obviously, if you’re so concerned that everyone else has to know, put it in the paper for a month. If you’re so insecure about your relationship that you have to give the Gov control of it, you have no business getting married.
            The pastor can issue a ‘Certificate of Holy Matrimony’. That is all that’s needed. If you must register, take and make a photocopy, and get a big red stamp, and stamp ‘copy’ on the copy, and register that with the gov. Whoever has the original, holds highest title, and whoever holds the original title makes the law regarding that title.
            One of my former Pastors came to me a few weeks ago on this very issue. He didn’t want me telling the people from his congregation to know that he same to me on this issue. I don’t blame him.
            Apparently, a number of pastors have been finding out what is actually going on in regards to birth certificates and marriage certificates. It has really unsettled the group of pastors that his is part of. I basically gave him the spiel I gave above.
            He got more than what he came for. Apparently from what my parents have said, some of what I said here is filtering into his preaching now. He want’s the board to give up the church’s not for profit status, and try to find a better way to run things so his tongue can be unbridled.
            The dead bones are starting to come back into complete skeletons now….

          • sam r ogilvie on 03/21/2011 at 12:41 pm

            Гламур-мур-мур!!!!:-*
            Mar. 18, 2011 at 3:14 am

            Kristina Medvedeva
            красивая))
            Mar. 18, 2011 at 3:19 am

            Yelizaveta Ortman
            Спасиб)))
            Mar. 18, 2011 at 3:19 am

            Edit Asatiani
            конфетка!))
            Mar. 18, 2011 at 4:20 am

            Yelizaveta Ortman
            пасибо))
            Mar. 18, 2011 at 4:23 am

            Sam Ogilvie
            Great look, Yelizaveta. I love the pose and the hat!
            Mar. 18, 2011 at 9:40 pm

            Yelizaveta Ortman
            Спасибо Сэмик=)))
            Mar. 19, 2011 at 4:04 am

            Edit Asatiani
            омагебл, это же тас хаван американский)))
            Mar. 19, 2011 at 9:17 am

            Edit Asatiani
            омагадебл*
            Mar. 19, 2011 at 9:35 am

            Sam Ogilvie
            Hello, Edit. What does “omagadebl, it’s tas Havan” mean? Yes, I love the way Yelizaveta dresses and looks! I hope she is not offended by my praise, because it is innocent and sincere. She has a great sense of style and outstanding taste!
            yesterday at 7:20 am

            Edit Asatiani
            I do not communicate with the old American masturbations)))
            yesterday at 7:40 am

            Sam Ogilvie
            I am sorry you feel that way, and have referred to me in such a manner. None of it is true, and it is not necessary. I am a man of honor!
            yesterday at 10:17 am

            Sam Ogilvie
            I could respond with anger and threats which I am very capable of backing up, but that would not be good and definitely not productive. I am blessed with hundreds of friends here in America and around the world. My life revolves around doing good and being of service to those around me. I wish you the very best, Edit.
            yesterday at 10:52 am

            Edit Asatiani
            bla bla bla. Tell it to someone else.
            yesterday at 2:13 pm

            Yelizaveta Ortman
            Виль, ты что опять покусала моего поклонника?)))
            today at 12:04 am

            Edit Asatiani
            Да, я так ждала когда ты придешь, увидишь и поржешь))) Потому что я даже англоязычного достаю))))
            today at 3:04 am

            Sam Ogilvie
            Нет проблем, Элизабет. Как вы знаете очень хорошо, я думаю, у вас отличное чувство стиля, и я люблю видеть ваши фотографии. Да, еще один с стекло!

            К сожалению, в этом мире, многие из нас либо неправильно истолкованы или жертв тирады время от времени. В моей молодости, я любил использовать мои боевые навыки и ударить ногами и кулаками, но я старше и умнее. Я устала от такой глупости. Я никогда не был один, чтобы затемнить невинных похвалы с завуалированной ссылки на секс, хотя. Я надеюсь, вы понимаете, что мое уважение чисты.
            today at 8:08 am

            Edit Asatiani
            we already knew. on your face shows that you are lying and do not need 2 times to write the same thing.American girls do not you give, you dream on photo Russian girls? like you, we can see right through.
            today at 8:26 am

            Sam Ogilvie
            Well, it seems futile to argue the point, but I am not here looking for a girlfriend. American girls are marvelous, and many nice girls are perfectly willing to accompany a decent man most anywhere he would like to go. I have nothing to prove. As I have said at my page, I am here to learn about the people and culture of Russia and its former republics. I have no argument with you. I am who I am. Unfortunately, most Russian men think a friend request indicates that I am gay and looking for something unsavory. Women seem to be more willing to add me as a friend, and answer my questions. It’s that simple. If that were not the case, most of my 157 friends at this site would be male, rather than female. Once again, I wish you well, Edit. I only want the best for you and your country.
            today at 11:13 am

            Edit Asatiani
            Do not be ridiculous. you have a list of some young girls. And you only notice their dress and style, but do not ask about Russia. Buy a book, study the country and its customs. But you know you have written on his face that you fuckin masturbation
            today at 1:21 pm

            Edit Asatiani
            and yet you are so repulsive that I do not know why my friend with you contact
            today at 1:23 pm

            Sam Ogilvie
            Actually, I ask many questions about the country and its customs. As I said, girls seem to be the most receptive to friend requests. Older women are few and far between at this site, and few of them respond to requests and inquiries.

            I enjoy the company of many women. In fact, I just had lunch with one. Her name is Teresa Allred, and she is a fine friend. I am thankful to the Lord for her and all my friends.

            I am sorry that you are so focused on sex. I enjoy talking and exploring ideas. I treat all women, here at this site, and those I know here locally with great dignity and respect. I am involved with plants…….things of beauty. Yes, I enjoy looking at pictures of stylish women. I appreciate fashionable dress, hairdos and the like on women. For that, I make no apology. Russian women are known worldwide for their beauty and fashion sense. Elizabeth is certainly one of them. Once again, Edit, I wish you well.
            Delete today at 2:21 pm

            Though some of the comments are profane, I thought some readers may have an interest in this most unpleasant exchange I had the Russian site VK. By and large, I have been most impressed with the women at that site, and most impressed with the few men I am “friends” with. As Rw_man has said many times, Russian has its share of female a…….. This woman, Edit, is one of them in my humble opinion. It also goes to show, as Rw_man has said many times, that there is no substitute for face-to-face contact with people. Only over time can people judge your actions and determine whether or not they match with stated intentions. Thousands of words would never convince the woman above that I am an honorable person. Testimonials from female friends here in the States would be worthless.

          • sam r ogilvie on 03/21/2011 at 3:01 pm

            Please excuse the profanity, but here is the last comment from a lady speaking to me at a friend’s page:
            Edit Asatiani
            Looks like ur some old fag freak … dont write me anymore shitface tard …
            Mark AS Spam | Reply today at 2:47 pm

            I apologize again for the woman’s profanity, but I think it is important for individuals to share their experiences with people from Russia and its former republics at this site.
            I have lived a long time here in the States, but I have yet to see such unwarranted, profanity-laced vehemence. This lady happens to reside in Moscow. Surprisingly, she is the first person from that city that I have had a bad experience with.

          • sam r ogilvie on 03/21/2011 at 3:03 pm

            I should add that I was commenting on a friend’s site, under a stylish picture she had posted. The lady named Edit is one of her friends.

          • Kisha on 03/22/2011 at 2:22 am

            Sam, that’s really terrible.
            I applaud your patience and self respect.

          • Kisha on 05/25/2011 at 2:42 am

            I came across this video and instantly thought about your argument with this girl on VK Sam.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QKr3M3G4TmE&feature=related

            Psychos like that give American men and foreingers in general a bad name. That’s what you fell a victim of.

          • Kisha on 05/25/2011 at 8:17 am

            What is worse that this pervert prays on schoolgirls. Today is the last day of school for the graduates and schools around the country hold what’s called last school bell ring. That’s why all girls and boys were wearing sashes.
            This day they “allowed” to be naughty so it’s no surpise all of them were a bit drunk.
            He was unbelievebly rude to all of them when he spoke Russian.
            I bet he also told them that he was a tourist and was looking for help. And as long it’s considered to be rude to refuse to talk to people they did exactly the same they would do to a Russian person. Gave him short answers and didn’t ask questions hoping that he would go away, but he stayed and kept filming their legs. O_O and trying to touch them. eewwwww

        • Richard on 03/19/2011 at 1:06 pm

          Kisha,

          Try not viewing all of my questions as sarcastic or antagonistic in nature. Generally I ask a question because I am seeking an answer. Its pretty much just that simple. I wasn’t sure what you were getting at by linking those particular articles, so I asked you what your intent was.

          I agree that Miss Kolchik’s tendency is to contradict herself in her writing, a trait which I often attribute to well minded people who’ve been overly influenced by social dogma or even worse, perpetual students in liberal arts and humanitarian educational programs.

          I appreciate your conclusion and thank you for the clarification.

          • Kisha on 03/21/2011 at 7:37 am

            Well Richard, I will certainly try to.

            I’m inclined to take contradictions as a sign of inconsistency. Which, rightly noted is commonly attributed to students of humanitarian programms.
            On the other hand it’s difficult to take those articles and the auther seriously because the writing is the stream of consciousness. Written by oneself to impress oneself. And I find it esp funny how she first complains about the Russian men and in the next one she talks that marriage orientated men are basically everywhere.

          • sam r ogilvie on 03/21/2011 at 3:23 pm

            Kisha,

            I have read the criticism of Russian men for several years now. American men are now catching much of the same. Spades of articles discussing the much larger number of women in colleges and universities, the larger number of unemployed men and the increasing income disparity between young women and young men in urban areas appear constantly.

            I can’t offer a macroeconomic or macro-social opinion, but the reasons are obvious locally. Though the United States continues to be a center of industrial production, the loss of employment(mostly male) due to increased efficiencies and the loss of industry to foreign competitors has left many men of all ages between a rock and a hard place. While home health agencies, the medical field in general and other female- dominated industries are growing substantially, a visit to machine shops and other male-dominated businesses tells a bleak tale. Unfortunately, males that enjoy welding and fabrication and the like seldom have any interest in nursing, marketing, human resources and other jobs that require one to wear a suit and bow to corporate culture. One can only hope that alcohol and drug abuse and the violence associated with urban minority populations doesn’t make substantial inroads into once thriving middle class areas.

        • sam r ogilvie on 03/21/2011 at 3:10 pm

          Wolverine,

          I live in a region known for its judgmental, self-righteous, fundamentalist know-it-alls. True, I have offered my Christian perspective at this site, but I realize I have been wrong at times, and may well be wrong at present. I agree with Richard, though. Faith is ultimately a personal thing, and we must all draw our own conclusions. After decades of being kind and listening reverently to people much like those you have encountered, I pretty much turn a deaf ear now. I can identify readily with your experience, and wish you the best of luck.

        • sam r ogilvie on 03/22/2011 at 6:05 am

          Thanks, Kisha. I don’t guess I will ever understand what ignited, Edit. I wish I could have said something to appease her. My dad always said that self-control and discipline would carry a person many a mile. My mom always said that two wrong don’t make a right. As expected, they are sounding smarter each and every day. I am working at all those things, really hard. Take care and let me know how your visit to the U.S. turned out, please.

          • Kisha on 03/28/2011 at 6:05 am

            Sometimes it doesn’t worth finding out, Sam.
            Just try not to take it personal.
            My visit to the US might not happen at all, thanks to the embassy which scheduled my interview well past the the conference =) Only if I decide to go there by my own now.
            Apologies for my late reply.

          • sam r ogilvie on 03/28/2011 at 1:57 pm

            Thanks, Kisha. If you really want to attend the conference, I think I can get get someone from my congresswoman’s office to expedite things for you. Please let me know.

          • sam r ogilvie on 03/28/2011 at 2:01 pm

            It’s probably best if I don’t know, Kisha. I am confident that you are right about that. Luckily, that was the first time that I have provoked that kind of vehemence, and hopefully will be the last.

          • Kisha on 03/29/2011 at 12:52 pm

            Thank you for your kind offer, Sam. But it’s far too late for the conference, unfortunately. It actually took place a while ago. But now I know Spaso house has strange priorities.

  16. Chuck on 03/18/2011 at 9:39 pm

    I used to live over seas in the Balkans for over 2 years. For most of my life I have lived in Maryland. The difference between the women in the two places is like night and day. Here’s why men go over to Eastern Europe or Russia to find a wife. We don’t want some leftist educated by old drug smoking hippies raising our kids or sharing our beds for that matter. Liberals make up less than 20% of the US population and a large portion of them are college kids who are just parroting a prof because they haven’t grown up yet. The vast majority of men are conservative and want wives that are as well. We don’t want a hippy douche bag. If we did, we would move to Cali or the northeast and marry there. When I was in Croatia I would meet beautiful women who were kind, humble and family minded. Slavic women who have not been poisoned by western feminism are still the best bet for a happy marriage in my opinion. If you want a Latina or Oriental woman, my hats off to you as well just don’t be stupid and marry some arrogant, controlling leftist wench. Peace.

  17. Peter-Andrew: Nolan(c) on 03/30/2011 at 1:09 pm

    What an interesting site! Thanks to spearhead for pointing me here. I found this article and it’s kind of interesting. If anyone wants to poke around what one foreign husband WAS like feel free. (http://www.peternolan.com/Forums/tabid/420/forumid/14/threadid/606/scope/posts/Default.aspx )

    Long story short. Great husband and father but after 23 years with one woman the kids were kidnapped, business destroyed, all female friends bar one betrayed me, in-laws betray me despite knowing me for 32 years, impoverished, suicidal for a month.

    Until I met….yep…you guessed it. A Ukranian woman!!

    We’d met 5-6 months earlier very briefly. I was looking for ‘wife 2.0’ and wanted to find one from my background (Australia) and she didn’t fit so we just laughed off our first meeting. By the time we re-met I was convinced all western women were complete fruitcakes and a mate of mine had said ‘try a Russian woman, I have heard they are good’. And this woman walked back into my life that very week. Complete accident.

    At that time I was starting the process of disowning my kids and soon became suicidal. This woman didn’t know this. She just knew something was wrong. To cut it short. She was very caring and very supportive despite not knowing me very well. The times we would meet up I would be very happy to be with her despite being suicidal. It was at the may day party of 2008 that she did and said something that had me think it might actually be worth living. She helped me save my life. And she barely knew me. Her other Russian women friends would also be very nice to me and supportive despite they didn’t know what was going on. When, a few months later, I finally told her that I have been disowning my former children she roundly denounced my ex and was very supportive of my decision. In fact NO eastern European woman has EVER criticised me for that but ALL western women hate on me. When I finally fessed up the FULL story about 12 months later again, that she had been instrumental in saving my life, she simply could not believe it. Took a while to sink in.

    Then, over the next 18 months from May 08 we spent quite a bit of time together. We grew very close. The issue was babies. She was then 34 with one son 16 and she wanted more babies. I had raised 4 so I didn’t. She asked straight up if I minded if she tried to change my mind. I told her she was welcome to try but that it would be no use. Typical Russian woman. She didn’t let that stand in her way. She tried VERY hard to sell me on more babies.

    She was also honest in the extreme. She even told me to my face that if we agreed to marry on the basis she would not have more children and she changed her mind she could cuckhold me and then try and close me on the baby deal. I so admired her honesty I damn near changed my mind. It was a good tactic. But by last October (2.5 years) I was coming up 47 and I was really sure I didn’t want more kids. We finally split as a possibility on the issue of babies. I told her that if she EVER changes her mind about no more kids to call me first. She can walk back into my life and be well taken care of as long as she does not want more kids.

    My Ukranian lady friend was easily the most beautiful woman I had ever met in my life. She has spoiled me for any other woman. I would not marry any other woman but her. So if she does not change her mind I will remain single. The idea Russian woman are ‘submissive’ is a complete joke. She was one of the strongest willed women I ever met but she knew how to be a woman. I also met a Chech woman who is easily the most lovely woman by personality I have ever met. I simply refuse to talk to western women now.

    Western husbands? Well? Australian men my age in the professional ranks like me make great husbands. Though some of us are very ‘beta-providers’ like I used to be. I upgraded to alpha about a year back. It is true women like a man to be far stronger than us beta-provider types. Since I turned Alpha I notice I am getting a LOT more attention. Seems the harsher I treat women the more they like me. Sound stupid but it’s true.

    But what a fascinating site! And yes. My vote is with Eastern European Women(EEW). I only date EEW in the 30-35 range. They have to have grown up under communism and the first thing I test for is to see if they realise feminism is communism in drag and that they strongly oppose feminism.

  18. Renee on 03/30/2011 at 6:51 pm

    Peter Andrew wrote: “the first thing I test for is to see if they realise feminism is communism in drag and that they strongly oppose feminism”
    I crack up because I know it’s true — and I say this as a former near-feminist! The thing is, when, as an American woman, you behave more like the Ukranian/Russian women you talk about, or even ‘fess up that you find their embrace of femininity appealing, many of your fellow American women will chew you up and spit you out!

    Anyway, good luck, Peter-Andrew.

  19. sam r ogilvie on 05/25/2011 at 4:58 pm

    Thanks for posting the video, Kisha, and adding your thoughts about it. I did take the time to view all of it. It was embarrassing and uncomfortable because he was so persistent, and made what I thought were some inappropriate comments, but I was very impressed with all the girls. They reminded me a great deal of young girls here in the American South that had the good fortune of being born and raised in good families.

    You are right, one man can give thousands of others a bad name, and make life much less pleasant and more difficult. Unfortunately, a middle-aged man in today’s world that maintains a genuine interest in people, other cultures, human nature and foreign relations is going to encounter some seriously negative feedback from females. Even close male friends misinterpret my interactions with females. If I take the time to ask some young university girl waiting on our table at a restaurant innocent questions about her field of study, family, etc., my friends invariably think I am looking for romance. That’s life, I guess. All I can say is I am really glad to have reached the stage in life where I really enjoy discussing issues and having good conversations. I am too old to change anyway. I’ve come to expect occasional problems, and have become a bit thicker skinned. Thanks again for your input.

    • Kisha on 05/26/2011 at 1:37 am

      True Sam. But I think it’s still worth doing.
      I’m hoping that here most people’s experince with foreigners is not built on encounters like above.
      Apparently there are plenty of all sorts of chancers and sex addicts hovering round Russia.
      The language barier also add to the list of the problems, it may take you a longer time to work out someone is a jerk, chav or just a sick person.

  20. R-Brides on 11/25/2011 at 3:26 pm

    I have a Ukrainian Girlfriend, and her opinions are that the Ukrainian guys are much more immature, and generally seem to treat their girlfriends, and wives worse than western men. Whether this is true could be up for debate for many pages on here, but if that is the perception from the young @marry age@ women in their 20′s and 30′s who generally are highly qualified and intelligent women, then it does not look good for the Russian and Ukrainian men! Not a bad thing for the western guy able to meet the stunningly attract intelligent women from Russia and Ukraine!

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